Records reveal concerns over NC State's Poe Hall go back decades
North Carolina State University must open a shuttered campus building to outside investigators, a judge ruled Wednesday.
The decision ends a five-month battle between the university and its alumni and employees who spent time in Poe Hall and later developed cancer and could pave the way for lawsuits against the university.
Alumni and employees tell WRAL 5 On Your Side they’ve lost faith in NC State’s own investigation into the once-busy classroom building. The university closed Poe Hall in November 2023 after testing revealed high levels of carcinogenic chemicals known as PCBs.
“The university has been putting this off for a long time,” said Dr. Kate Norwalk, a breast cancer survivor who spent seven years working in Poe Hall. “They’ve been telling us that they care about us, that they’ve been looking into the building, and they can’t answer health questions until they know about the building.”
The university’s own investigation has been marked by delays. Records show the Environmental Protection Agency [EPA] tried several times to get a hold of the university before it responded. In January, NC State stopped participating in a federal health investigation. In February, the university reversed course following public outcry prompted by a WRAL 5 On Your Side report.
5 On Your Side receives 192 reports of cancer from people who worked or studied in NC State's Poe Hall
In the more than five months since NC State closed Poe Hall, WRAL 5 On Your Side has received more than 190 reports of cancer in people who worked or studied in the once-busy classroom building.
The cases included in this count were either self-reported or reported by family members of deceased alumni or employees; 21 people in the count are dead.
Nearly 50% of the people who reported cancer say they were diagnosed in the last five years. WRAL 5 On Your Side began collecting the cancer cases to better understand the potential public health crisis, after NC State said it would not.
The Poe Hall timeline: What did NC State know and when?
Documents filed in court provide new answers to the question of when NC State knew about health concerns in Poe Hall. A letter from 2012, sent to the university’s Environmental Health Department, shows faculty expressed concerns over the air quality in Poe Hall as far back as 2007. The letter, sent by an associate dean at the time, states an employee had to place ‘cheesecloth’-like fabric over vents to serve as an additional filter. The associate dean asked the department to conduct testing to confirm there was “nothing dangerous” in Poe Hall. It is unclear if that testing ever happened.
In 2018, testing on the exterior of Poe Hall revealed high levels of toxic chemicals in caulking on the exterior of the building. In 2020, an employee in Poe Hall battling breast cancer who was aware of others battling the same disease told 5 On Your Side she reported her concerns to her superiors.
It took a group of separate Poe Hall employees battling cancer to complain to North Carolina Department of Labor and the EPA before NC State tested the interior of Poe Hall in 2023. Within four months, the building was closed.
NC State’s investigation into Poe Hall marked by delays
Records showed the EPA learned about the PCBs found in Poe Hall and the closure of the building through a WRAL 5 On Your Side report. The agency tried to contact the university for weeks to discuss the situation before the university responded.
In the nearly six months since closing Poe Hall, NC State has not allowed the EPA or state health department into the seven-story building, much to the dismay of alumni and employees who believe the toxic chemicals found in Poe Hall may have led to their cancers.
When asked about this, NC State Chancellor Randy Woodson told WRAL 5 On Your Side, “we own the building,” and that he was focused on testing conducted by university consultants.
'We own the building': NC State hires Geosyntec Consultants to test Poe Hall
A month after closing Poe Hall, NC State hired Geosyntec Consultants to collect samples in the building.
The goal, Woodson said, was to study “what issues may exist in the building” to know if there were “any potential impacts on health.”
But the university has released little information on the building or potential health impacts in the five months since Geosyntec began testing.
In February, Geosyntec released the results of their first round of testing. It showed Geosyntec took around 87 samples inside Poe Hall but noted more testing was on the way. Dr. Robert Herrick, a former Harvard faculty member who studies PCBs, told WRAL 5 On Your Side that the university would need to collect hundreds or perhaps more than a thousand samples in Poe Hall to fully understand the potential PCB exposure in the building.
Expert expresses 'serious concerns' over testing methodolgy
In a sworn affidavit, environmental expert Dr. Ranajit Sahu said he had “serious concerns” over Geosyntec’s handling of Poe Hall.
Sahu, who was hired by attorneys representing alumni and employees challenging NC State, was critical of NC State’s refusal to publicly release Geosyntec Consultants' sampling protocols and methods.
“Such protocols and methods would not withstand peer review or public scrutiny,” Sahu said.
Sahu said he had several problems with NC State and Geosyntec’s handling of the building’s HVAC system.
The HVAC system had been off since the university closed Poe Hall in November 2023. Attorneys working on behalf of NC State admitted that the university had turned it back on mid-April but did not take any air samples. Sahu called it “a lost opportunity to gather evidence of PCB or other contaminants.
Tired of waiting, NC State alumnus battling cancer files petition to investigate Poe Hall
In March, Woodson told WRAL 5 On Your Side the final Geosyntec results would likely be out by the end of April. Attorneys representing NC State now say another Geosyntec report will be out near the end of May.
A spokesperson for NC State blamed the delays on a separate mainframe renovation taking place in Poe Hall.
A petition filed on behalf of former NC State graduate student Darren Masier argued the investigation conducted by consultants hired by NC State was insufficient and dragging on.
“It’s an abomination,” David Kirby, Masier’s attorney, told the presiding Judge Hoyt Tessener.
Masier, who is battling leukemia, spent four years inside Poe Hall studying for his doctorate. He told WRAL 5 On Your Side that he was done waiting for NC State’s results.
Kirby argued NC State was "delaying justice" by not allowing independent experts inside Poe Hall.
Kirby told Tessener his PCB experts would be able to collect thousands of samples inside Poe Hall in a matter of weeks.
“I love this university, but I don’t understand what they are hiding,” Masier said.
In court, attorneys working on behalf of NC State told Tessener that Masier’s petition belongs in a separate court, the Industrial Commission, as a workers comp complaint.
“They’re trying to fit a square peg in a round hole,” said Todd Roessler, a partner at Kilpatrick, Townsend & Stockton. “They are causing their own delay.”
Kirby and attorney Bryan Brice pointed to a separate worker’s comp complaint filed by Dr. Kate Norwalk. Norwalk spent years in Poe Hall and was diagnosed with breast cancer in 2022. She filed her complaint in December but told WRAL 5 On Your Side she had to wait four months before NC State allowed her experts inside to collect a few swipe samples. Tessener asked Roessler and Joseph Dowdy, another Kilpatrick, Townsend & Stockton partner, what the downside to more testing was “why is that a bad thing?”
'Feeling awesome': Judge allows independent experts into Poe Hall
After an hour hearing, Tessener decided in favor of Masier. The decision will allow independent experts to access to the building and give attorneys the ability depose NC State leaders, like Woodson, about Poe Hall.
The university now has 30 days to turn over documents related to Poe Hall and let the outside experts into the building.
“I’m feeling awesome,” Masier told 5 On Your Side when asked about the decision
Where did the PCBs come from?
Prior to a 1979 EPA ban, PCBs were commonly used in building materials such as insulation, paint, caulking and machinery.
Unless actively removed, PCBs remain present in many schools and government buildings today. Unlike other contaminants, PCBs do not have to be disturbed to become problematic. Because they are semi-volatile, they can leach out into the air and enter the human body.
Many buildings built between the 1950s and 1979 contain PCBs, experts tell WRAL 5 On Your Side.
Vermont is the only state that requires certain buildings be tested proactively.
Current, EPA guidance recommends buildings be tested for PCBs only if there is a known problem.
In 2024, the EPA updated its PCB guidance. The changes focused more on how entities remove PCBs once found, not on proactive testing.
Records show NC State has no plans to proactively test other campus buildings.
You can find complete and comprehensive coverage of the Poe Hall investigation on WRAL.com.
