So Long Lightsabers (Perhaps): Kasdan Has Tried to Leave ‘Star Wars’ Before

BEVERLY HILLS, Calif. — The “Star Wars” films are known for their exotic aliens, sophisticated robots, sleek technology and planet-sized battle stations. That some of these movies also possess a measure of humanity is due in part to Lawrence Kasdan, the screenwriter and filmmaker George Lucas recruited to write “The Empire Strikes Back,” the first “Star Wars” sequel, and with whom Lucas wrote its follow-up, “Return of the Jedi.” On these films, Kasdan, 69, helped bring to life some of the saga’s most enduring moments, including Luke Skywalker’s fateful discovery that Darth Vader was his father.

Kasdan, who also wrote “Raiders of the Lost Ark” and directed his own screenplays for “Body Heat,” “The Big Chill” and other films, made the deliberate decision to stay away from “Star Wars” for many years. But he was drawn back in for “The Force Awakens,” the 2015 film written with J.J. Abrams, that reinvigorated the series after a decade of inactivity. And now Kasdan and his son Jonathan are the screenwriters of “Solo: A Star Wars Story,” a new movie that fills in the back story of Han Solo.

I recently asked Lawrence Kasdan to take me through his career. With help from Jonathan Kasdan at his side and Harrison Ford (by phone), he spoke in depth about the romantic comedy that provided entree to “Raiders,” the highs and lows of his “Star Wars” work, and his mixed feelings about the franchise.

LAWRENCE KASDAN: It took me a long time to sell anything. The first was [the Whitney Houston movie] “The Bodyguard,” which didn’t get made until much later. Then “Continental Divide” was purchased, almost immediately, in a bidding war, by Steven. He said, “What are you doing next?” I said, “I’d really like to do a Bond movie.” He said, “Oh, I’ve got something much better than Bond.” They had started talking about Indiana Jones. Something based on the old movie serials, a hero named after George’s dog, Indiana, and he has a whip. The MacGuffin is something that [the filmmaker] Philip Kaufman’s orthodontist told him about when he was 11. It’s the lost ark of the covenant. I said, “That sounds cool.”

KASDAN: Steven says to me, “I showed George ‘Continental Divide,’ and he loves the way they talk — that’s the feeling we want, that 1930s banter.” We had this meeting — there was me and Steven, [the producers] Frank Marshall and Howard Kazanjian. George did something I never saw him do again. He said, “Let’s shake hands on this. Maybe this is a historic moment.” And he gets up from behind his desk. We all go into the center — Howard, Frank, me — and we shake hands.

KASDAN: When George brought me in, he knew what the story was. If he had said, “I want you to create the second ‘Star Wars,'” I would have said, “Wait, slow down here.” But he said, “I’ll tell you what we’re doing — you write it.” The first thing he said was, “You know, Darth Vader is Luke’s father.” And I thought, OK, we’re gold now. This is much more interesting than I thought it was going to be.

JONATHAN KASDAN: “Empire” is the perfect one, the one everybody talks about. And yet, in this age of multiple-sequel trilogy things, it’s very hard to come up with an example of someone who has done it as successfully as that. “Avengers: Infinity War” really has that “Star Wars” shape. There are three movies going on simultaneously. They really felt almost no burden to tie the people together at the end. They just felt like, this is a moment in the story and we’re going to stop now. Pick it up next year.

LAWRENCE KASDAN: I had seen “A New Hope,” of course. It had electrified me exactly like it did everybody else, but the thing that really got me was Harrison Ford. My heroes were Steve McQueen and the Magnificent Seven and the Seven Samurai. He embodied that spirit. You’ve been living your whole life as, gee, I wish I had the balls to do this. Han never thinks about it. Even if he’s wrong, it’s forward motion. He never stops and says, “Oh, what am I risking?” That attracted me in 1977 and attracted me now.

KASDAN: I didn’t write it. It took me a long time to even accept. That happens a lot. Sometimes they change them in a way that’s much better. At the moment it bothered me. Now I hope I get credit for it. [laughs]

FORD: Were the Ewoks there? That was “Jedi.” When I think about Ewoks, I can always remember Larry standing in the back, off camera, grumbling and shaking his head.

KASDAN: I was for killing [Han Solo]. “Empire” didn’t seem like the right spot. I thought in “Jedi,” we’re closing off the trilogy. And we want to lose somebody important. It would give some stakes to this thing. And George did not like it.

FORD:I argued for Han Solo’s demise, because he wasn’t part of the bigger story. And then [in “The Force Awakens"] they made him part of the bigger story, and then they killed him. Just when I thought I’d figured it out, they figured it out for me and retired my country ass.

KASDAN: I wanted to move on. I was making a lot of movies, and I was doing it on a pretty regular basis. There were many times over the ensuing years when George [asked] me to be involved in all three [prequels]. He said, “Hey, how would you like to write such-and-such?” I said, “George, aren’t you supposed to start shooting in two weeks, in Australia?” He said, “Yeah, but it’s not too late.” I was at the first screening of “The Phantom Menace.” And it was just so different that I didn’t really know what to make of it. It had no connection, in my mind, to what we had done. Your eyes are just like, what? How does this work?

LAWRENCE KASDAN: At the end of 2012, Kathy said, “We want to make some more ‘Star Wars’ movies. Will you come up and talk about it?” I said, “I don’t really want to.” It was out of respect for Kathy and George that I went. I said, “I just feel like I’ve done this.” They said, “We want to do a movie about Han.” That got me. That was the only one that could possibly have gotten me. They had already hired Michael Arndt to write Episode VII. They also wanted me to consult on [that]. We’re in a room in this hotel in Santa Monica, just trying to figure out what Episode VII should be, and Michael was struggling as much as any of us. Then it got more intense, because now J.J. [Abrams] came in, so it’s me and J.J. and Michael and a bunch of executives from Lucasfilm, going, “Well, what could happen next?” That is no way to write something, and it went on for months.

JONATHAN KASDAN: My mother and I were very gung-ho. We thought, you’ve got to take this opportunity. These movies are going to be seen by the whole world. And it matters that they be infused with as much sensitivity and intelligence as they can be.

LAWRENCE KASDAN: They were getting close to when they were supposed to start production. We had nothing. So they came to me and said, “Will you do this with J.J.? We told Michael and he’s good with it.” I said all right. It was just us. They got rid of everybody. Now you’re free.

LAWRENCE KASDAN: It had been 30 years since we saw Han. We’d all gone through 30 years of life, and what it tells you is, you make the same mistakes again and again. I’d gotten older. But my personality hadn’t changed, and I didn’t think Han’s would change. But what do you learn, one way or another? What does life teach you? How does your experience make you a more interesting person? And all the regrets you have, and all the disappointments? That was the basis of Han.

FORD: For me, that was the ultimate value and the pleasure of playing that character. I loved the fact that he turns out to be a reasonable continuum of character, but acknowledging the reality of the passage of 30 years. Boys will be boys. There’s no accounting for that.

JONATHAN KASDAN: I’ll have to kill him, eventually.

LAWRENCE KASDAN: The wheel turns. [Laughter] No, it was very scary.

JONATHAN KASDAN: I am a “Star Wars” nerd and I’m a writing nerd, but we both had a lot of trepidation about it. As the son of someone like Larry, you find yourself in the odd position of being, in a way, the most reverent fan ever of their work. And the least.

LAWRENCE KASDAN: No one is harder on you than your son. His values have become your values. And at the same time, you’ve seen him, intimately, for 35 years of your life, and there’s no mystique.

JONATHAN KASDAN: We would argue and there would be things that bugged each of us. By the end of the process, after 3 1/2 years, we tried so many things, there was no stone left unturned. And the good stuff does rise to the top, I think.

LAWRENCE KASDAN: I was worn out from “Force Awakens” and I really needed him to do this. The actual working turned out to be, naturally, ragged at moments, and then basically kind of sublime. You couldn’t have guaranteed that.

LAWRENCE KASDAN: Yes. Absolutely. The last.

JONATHAN KASDAN: He intends it that way. But never say never. [Laughter]

LAWRENCE KASDAN: I like this one so much. Who knows? But I do not want to do another.