Name: On the Record: The future of energy in NC
Uploaded: 2023-01-07T20:26:45-0500
Duration: 1410115
Description: Broadly speaking the new Carbon Plan approved last week calls on Duke Energy to retire the vast majority of its coal-burning power plants, which right now produce 25 percent of electricity in the state.

9 NC counties are under alert, including Moore and Hoke counties.

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Tonight at 6 on WRAL: Juvenile crime is up 20%. WRAL Investigates goes inside new juvenile justice facilities to see new ways the system is approaching punishment and rehabilitation.

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Broadly speaking the new Carbon Plan approved last week calls on Duke Energy to retire the vast majority of its coal-burning power plants, which right now produce 25 percent of electricity in the state.

>> IT'S TIME TO GO ON THE RECORD WRAL NEWS. >> GOOD EVENING. I'M TRAVIS FAIN. TONIGHT WE DISCUSS A NEW ENERGY PLAN THAT WILL AFFECT NORTH CAROLINA FOR DECADES TO COME BROADLY SPEAKING, THE NEW CARBON PLAN APPROVED LAST WEEK CALLS ON DUKE ENERGY TO RETIRE THE VAST MAJORITY OF ITS COAL BURNING POWER PLANTS, WHICH RIGHT NOW PRODUCED 25% OF ELECTRICITY IN THE STATE. THOSE PLANTS BELOW TENS OF MILLIONS OF TONS OF HEAT TRAPPING CARBON DIOXIDE INTO THE AIR EACH YEAR CONTRIBUTING TO CLIMATE CHANGE. THE NEW PLAN STARTS BY BOOSTING SOLAR ENERGY IN THE STATE. BUT IT ALSO SETS THE STAGE FOR DUKE ENERGY TO BUILD NEW NATURAL GAS PLANTS DOWN THE LINE WHICH COME WITH THEIR OWN CLIMATE COSTS. WE'LL BREAK THIS ALL DOWN WITH A PANEL OF EXPERTS, MOST OF WHOM HAD INPUT IN THE PLAN ITSELF. THEY'RE NOT ALL HAPPY WITH WHAT STATE REGULATORS DECIDED. WE INVITED DUKE ENERGY EXECUTIVES TO PARTICIPATE IN THIS CONVERSATION OR TO SIT FOR AN INTERVIEW OFFERED TO RECORD AT THE TIME OF THEIR CHOOSING. THEY DECLINED. SO WE PRESS ON WITHOUT THEM. PETER LEDFORD IS GOVERNOR ROY COOPER'S CLEAN ENERGY DIRECTOR AND HIS BACKGROUND IS IN RENEWABLE ENERGY ADVOCATE ADVOCACY DAVID MEALS, AN ENVIRONMENTAL ATTORNEY WHO ARGUES ENERGY REGULATION BEFORE THE NORTH CAROLINA UTILITIES COMMISSION. THAT'S THE BODY THAT APPROVED THIS PLAN THEATER STARTING WITH YOU. LAYMAN'S DESCRIPTION, PLEASE OF WHAT THIS CARBON PLAN IS AND WHAT IT SHOULD ACCOMPLISH IN THE NEAR AND LONG TERMS. >> SHARON, THANK YOU, TRAVIS. THE GOVERNOR KNOWS THAT THE MARKET IS MOVING TO CLEAN ENERGY AND THEN HITTING AGGRESSIVE CARBON REDUCTION GOALS FOR THE RIGHT THING TO DO TO COMBAT CLIMATE CHANGE, BUT ALSO TO ENSURE THAT NORTH CAROLINA IS A LEADER IN THIS TRANSITION AND CAN BENEFIT FROM THE GOOD JOBS IS CREATING AND THE GOVERNOR'S LADIES AS CLEAR PRIORITIES. I THINK THAT'S REFLECTED IN HOUSE BILL 9.51, WHICH REQUIRES TO THE CURRENT PLAN THAT SETS OUT THE NEED TO ACHIEVE THESE CLIMATE AND CLEAN ENERGY REDUCING EMISSIONS BY 70% BY 2030 AND TO BE NET 0 BY  >> YEAH. HOUSE BILL 9, 5, 1, IS KIND OF THE UNDERLYING BILL AND THEN THAT KICK THINGS OVER TO THE UTILITY COMMISSION TO DECIDE THE MORE DETAIL PLAN, WHAT THE MIX OF ENERGY, DUKE ENERGY WOULD HAVE GOING FORWARD. DAVID, YOUR ORGANIZATION WAS CRITICAL OF THE IN THIS KIND OF YEAR-LONG SAGA WE'VE HAD OR TELL US, TELL US WHAT YOU DO AND WHAT YOU DON'T LIKE ABOUT THE PLAN THAT THE COMMISSION ULTIMATELY APPROVED. >> THANK YOU, TRAVIS. I I THINK THERE WAS BROAD CONSENSUS FROM A DIVERSE RANGE OF STAKEHOLDERS AND INTERVENE. ERS THAT WAS APPROPRIATE FOR THE COMMISSION TO FOCUS ON THE NEAR TERM ACTION PLAN. AND THAT'S WHAT THE COMMISSION DEAD. I WILL. I THINK WHAT WHERE THERE'S? SOME DISAGREEMENT IS IN THE COMMISSION'S DECISION TO ADOPT DUQUE'S PROPOSED. ACTION PLAN FROM ITS MAY FILING ALMOST HOPE OFF. YOU KNOW, BEFORE THERE WAS AN EXPERT OF AN REHEARING BEFORE THEY HEARD FROM THE PUBLIC BEFORE THERE WAS EXPERT REPORT SUBMITTED INTO THE RECORD. SO I THINK THAT'S A BIG PART OF OF WHAT WE'RE STILL TRYING TO GET OUR HEADS AROUND MOVING AS WE LOOK TO UPDATES OF THE CARBON PLAN. STARTING LATER THIS YEAR. BUT WE CERTAINLY APPRECIATE THAT. THERE'S GOING TO BE NEW INVESTMENTS IN SOLAR AND BATTERY STORAGE LAYING THE GROUNDWORK FOR NEW INVESTMENTS AND ON SHORE IN OFFSHORE WIND. CERTAINLY APPRECIATE THE COMMISSION'S RECOGNITION OF THE IMPORTANCE OF ENERGY ASKING DUKE TO DO MORE THAN IT INITIALLY PROPOSED ON ENERGY EFFICIENCY. YEAH. BUT ON ENERGY EFFICIENCY, I THINK DUKE WANTED TO ACHIEVE A ONE PERCENT REDUCTION AND THE COMMISSION SAID WILL TRY FOR 1.5%. IT CAN YOU PUT THAT IN CONTEXT A LITTLE BUT THAT SEEMS LIKE A REAL SMALL NUMBER. >> FOR FOR MANY WE HAVE ADVOCATED FOR FOR DUKE ENERGY TO ACHIEVE AT LEAST ONE PER CENT SAVINGS OF TOTAL RETAIL SALES. >> WHICH WOULD KIND OF PUT IT IF THE NATIONAL AVERAGE MORE OR LESS. AND DUKE ENERGY CAROLINAS HAS ACHIEVED THAT A COUPLE OF TIMES TO COUNTRY PROGRESS IS FALLING SHORT. BUT THAT WAS BEFORE THERE WAS THIS REQUIREMENT TO AGGRESSIVELY REDUCE CARBON POLLUTION AND THE MOST COST EFFECTIVE WAY POSSIBLE. TRYING TO RAMP UP TO 1.5% OR EVEN HIGHER IN FUTURE WOULD WOULD ACTUALLY. BUT DUKE ABOVE AVERAGE AND GIVE US A CHANCE HELP ACHIEVE THOSE CARBON REDUCTION GOALS AT A MUCH LESS COST THAN GOING OUT AND BUILDING A NEW POWER PLANT. SO UTILITY PROGRAMS THAT HELP INSTALL INSULATION PUT IN MORE EFFICIENT APPLIANCES. LET'S GO A LONG WAY TO HELPING TO MEET OUR ENERGY NEEDS WHILE SAVING MONEY ON OUR BILLS. ALL RIGHT. I WANT TO MENTION THAT YOU MENTIONED THAT DUKE ENERGY PROGRESS, DUKE ENERGY, CAROLINAS. >> WHAT WE THINK ABOUT IS DUKE ENERGY IN THE STATE IS ACTUALLY 2 COMPANIES. ONE OPERATE IN THE EAST WHEN OPERATING IN THE WEST PIER. WANT TO COME BACK TO YOU ON CHRISTMAS EVE. DUKE ENERGY HAD A NUMBER OF PROBLEMS, INCLUDING THAT SOME OF ITS COAL AND NATURAL GAS UNITS FAILED TO PRODUCE ENOUGH POWER TO MEET DEMAND. WE HAD ROLLING BLACKOUTS AFFECTED ABOUT HALF A MILLION PEOPLE. WHAT IS THAT EVENT TEACHING US ABOUT LONG-TERM POWER TEASE BECAUSE LONG-TERM POWER NEEDS. THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE WITH THIS CURRENT PLAN. WHAT ARE WE LEARNING FROM THE BLACKOUTS? I THINK THE CHRISTMAS EVE OUTAGES REALLY EMPHASIZE WHY WE NEED FLEXIBILITY. THAT HOUSE BILL 9.51, PROVIDES TO ENSURE THAT THE GREATEST, RESILIENT, RELIABLE, AFFORDABLE, AND CLEAN. >> AS YOU NOTED, DURING THE BLACKOUT, WE SAW OUTAGES REDUCTIONS THAT CALL A NATURAL GAS FACILITIES. BUT SOLAR PERFORMED AS EXPECTED. THIS REALLY HIGHLIGHTS THE NEED FOR A BALANCED APPROACH TO OUR KERR AND ENSURING THAT WE'RE MEETING THE CARBON REDUCTION GOALS OF HOUSE BILL 9.51. WHILE TAKING INTO CONSIDERATION OUR ABILITY TO MAINTAIN RELIABLE AND AFFORDABLE ENERGY. YOU KNOW, WE'VE HEARD FROM SOME REPUBLICANS THAT FOSSIL FUELS ARE THE ONLY RELIABLE OPTION, BUT IT'S CERTAINLY WORTH NOTING THAT BOTH IN OUR RECENT BLACKOUTS AND TEXAS IN 2021, IT WAS THE FOSSIL FUEL SYSTEMS THAT BROKE LEAVING FAMILIES IN THE CALLED IN AT LEAST IN TEXAS, FACING INTERNET COSTS. >> YEAH, IT DUKE ENERGY HAS SAID THAT IT WAS INSTRUMENTATION LINES THAT FROZE HERE AS OPPOSED TO A FREEZING NATURAL GAS LINES. I BELIEVE WE SAW IN SOME OTHER DAVID, WANT TO GO BACK TO YOU THAT AS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT NATURAL GAS. SO DUKE ENERGY ARGUES THAT SOLAR POWER, BATTERY STORAGE, VARIOUS RENEWABLE TECHNOLOGIES TO JUST NOT THERE YET. THEY CAN'T FULLY REPLACE COAL, WHICH IS LIKE I SAID, 25% OF OUR ENERGY IN THE STATE. SO WE NEED THIS NATURAL GAS BRIDGE TO GET TO THAT CLEAN ENERGY FUTURE FUTURE. I KNOW YOU DISAGREE WITH THE COMPANY ABOUT THE PACE OF TECHNOLOGICAL ADVANCE MERE. BUT LET ME ASK YOU THIS. SO DO TOLD THE COMMISSION THAT DELAYING A SINGLE NATURAL GAS PLANT IN THIS PLAN AND THAT'S KEEPING A COAL-FIRED PLANT ONLINE INSTEAD THAT THAT WOULD PUT ANOTHER 2 BILLION TONS OF CARBON DIOXIDE INTO THE ATMOSPHERE 2030. SO AT SOME POINT THERE'S A DIMINISHING RETURN TO THE STRATEGY OF SKIPPING THE NATURAL GAS BRIDGE RIGHT? BECAUSE IT KEEPS CALL ONLINE LONGER. NEGATING THE GAMES. YOU GET. >> WELL, I WOULD HAVE A DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE ON THAT. RESPECTFULLY, I HEART OF WHAT. EXPERTS SHOWED IN THE CURRENT PLAN HEARING IS UP PATHWAY FOR ACHIEVING THOSE CARBON REDUCTION REQUIREMENTS WITHOUT ADDING NEW GAS ON THE SYSTEM. AND AND WE ACHIEVED THAT IN A MORE COST-EFFECTIVE WAY. THEN THEN SOME OF DICK'S PROPOSALS. A LARGE PART BY THE RELY MORE IN THE SHORT TERM ON SOLAR STORAGE AND EVENTUALLY MORE ON THE WIND. WIND IS A VERY COMPLIMENTARY RESOURCE FOR PARTICULARLY IN THESE EARLY WINTER WHEN OBVIOUSLY SOLAR IS NOT GOING TO BE AVAILABLE. WE CERTAINLY ALSO SUPPORTED THE THE NEED TO IMPROVE THE PUMPED HYDRO STORAGE, WHICH ALSO PERFORMED REALLY WELL. AND THIS EXTREME WEATHER ABOUT. WHILE WE ABSOLUTELY NEED CLOSE THOSE COAL-FIRED POWER PLANTS AS SOON AS POSSIBLE AND TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE REFINANCING. THE SECURITIZATION THAT'S AVAILABLE TO HELP SAVE CUSTOMERS MONEY. WE DON'T THINK THAT WE NEED A BRIDGE OF OF NEW GAS, PARTICULARLY GIVEN THE CONSTRAINTS ON SUPPLY THAT WE'RE EXPERIENCING AND THE HALL TO PRICE THAT WE'RE EXPERIENCING. IT'S REALLY BEEN A BIG DRIVER IN INCREASING OUR POWER BILLS IN RECENT MONTHS. >> DAVID, STAY WITH YOU HERE AT THIS PLAN. THIS ORDER FROM THE STATE HAS COMMISSIONED. IT DOESN'T TELL DUKE ENERGY YOU WILL BUILD NEW NATURAL GAS TELLS THE COMPANY PREPARES TO PREPARE FOR THAT STEP. SOMETHING THE DUKE ENERGY WANTS TO DO. BUT THE COMMISSION ALL SAID, LET'S BE FLEXIBLE. KEEP AN EYE TECHNOLOGICAL ADVANCES THAT COULD CHANGE THE GAME HERE. WHAT ARE THE CHANCES THAT WE NEVER BUILD THESE NEW DATA GAS PLANTS THEY'RE CONTEMPLATING? I MEAN, IS THAT IT IS HOW CLOSE TO SET IN STONE IS NATURAL GAS FOR NORTH CAROLINA. >> IT'S NOT ALL SENTENCED. AND I DO THINK YOU'VE HIGHLIGHTED AN IMPORTANT PART OF THE COMMISSION'S ORDER WHERE THEY MADE IT CLEAR THAT IN THE FUTURE, KERMIT PROCEEDING UP A CERTIFICATE OF PUBLIC CONVENIENCE AND NECESSITY PROCEEDING. THERE'S NO PRESUMPTION OF NEED FROM ANY OF THE FINDINGS. AND THE COMMISSION'S ORDER. YOU KNOW, ANOTHER BIG FACTOR HERE IS THE INFLATION REDUCTION ACT. SO WHEN CONGRESS PASSED THAT NEW FEDERAL LEGISLATION, IT'S GOING HAVE A BIG IMPACT ON DRIVING DOWN THE COSTS OF BATTERY STORAGE, SOLAR AND WIND. OVER THE NEXT DECADE. AND THAT COULD. CAN DEMONSTRATE THAT THERE'S A MORE COST-EFFECTIVE WAY FORWARD THAN BUILDING NEW GAS PLANTS. THAT ARE AT RISK OF BECOMING A STRANDED ASSET AT RISK OF BEING SOMETHING THAT'S BUILT. AND WE CAN'T. TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THEIR FULL USEFUL BECAUSE OF THE NEED TO REACH NET 0 EMISSIONS BY 2050. >> ALL RIGHT. WE'LL TALK A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT SOME OF THOSE POINTS RIGHT NOW. WE'RE GOING TAKE A BREAK. WHEN WE COME BACK, WE WILL ADD TO OUR PANEL HEARING FOR THE MANUFACTURING SECTOR ON THEIR THEIR ENERGY NEEDS FROM A STATE LAWMAK ALL RIGHT. THANKS FOR STAYING WITH US. THE ENERGY POLICY WE'VE BEEN DISCUSSING IS BASED ON A LAW THAT PASSED NORTH CAROLINA GENERAL ASSEMBLY IN 2021. HOUSE BILL 9, 5, 1, FORMER STATE REPRESENTATIVE JOHN SOCA HELPED WRITE THAT LAW AND HE'S WITH US NOW. REPRESENTATIVES OUT OF THE WAY THAT WILL WORK AS IT LEFT A LOT OF DECISIONS UP TO THE NORTH CAROLINA UTILITIES COMMISSION WHICH REGULATES DUKE ENERGY RELIES ON THE COMPANY. ENVIRONMENTALIST INDUSTRY, THE HOST OF OTHER STAKEHOLDERS FOR INPUT AS IT MAKES THESE DECISIONS. THE CARBON PLAN THAT THE COMMISSION APPROVED. HOW WELL DO YOU THINK IT MATCHES LEGISLATIVE INTENT AND WHAT WAS THAT INTENT? >> WELL, MY WHEN WE HAD THE INITIAL HEARINGS IN THE HOUSE WITH THE INITIAL DRAFT OF MY 51, WE ACTUALLY TRIED TO. WHICH COAL PLANTS WERE SHUT DOWN, WHAT THEY DID TIME AND WHAT MAKES WITH BAY IF YOU RECALL THOSE DISCUSSIONS. THEY WERE ACRIMONIOUS AND NOBODY CAN REALLY WHAT WE SHOULD DO. SO THE DECISION WAS MADE A PERSON BUILT IN THE SENATE. 2, LET THE UTILITIES COMMISSION MAKE THOSE DECISIONS BECAUSE SUPPOSEDLY THEY HAVE ALL THE EXPERTS. THEY HAVE ACCESS TO MUCH MORE DATA THAN WE DID. A LEGISLATURE. SO THAT WAS HOW WE GOT WHERE THE BILL FINALLY ENDED UP. I WOULD SAY THAT THE IN MY OPINION. THAT THE COMMISSION TO FAIRLY GOOD JOB INTERPRETING AND IMPLEMENTING THE LAW. COMING UP WITH THE CURRENT PLAN NOT BASED ON 2 THINGS. ONE IS THAT ENERGY POLICY IS EXTREMELY COMPLEX AND THEY HAVE DONE A GOOD JOB OF USING ALL THE RESOURCES THEY HAVE AVAILABLE TO COME UP WITH A GOOD START ON THIS LAW DOES MANDATE THE TWO-YEAR REVIEW TO MAKE SURE WE'RE HEADING IN THE RIGHT DIRECTION, BUT PROBABLY TAKE THE RIGHT CONSERVATIVE APPROACH TO GET IS FROM GUIDANCE TO DO ANOTHER STAND. LAMENT THIS. I GUESS THE BOTTLE. BUT I I WOULD JUST LIKE THAT ON THIS IS THAT THE LEGISLATURE, THE BOTH SIDES, THOSE WHO WANT CONSERVATIVE AND THOSE WHERE ALL THE GROWTH AND HAPPY THAT'S PROBABLY GOING TO DO. AND I WOULD SAY THAT THE REACTION TALKED TO NUMEROUS PEOPLE SO FAR, BOTH SIDES OF THE SCALE, THE SUMMER UNHAPPY. A LOT OF THEM HAVE BEEN BOTH SIDES, WHICH MEANS THAT THINK THAT THEY IT'S ALWAYS COMMISSION, HAS MADE GOOD START ON THIS PROCESS. >> IT'S ALWAYS GOING TO POLITICIAN BRAGS ABOUT MAKING PEOPLE UNHAPPY. I LIKE IT. THIS IS ALL A BALANCING ACT, WHICH I THINK IS WHAT YOU'RE REFERRING LOWERING CARBON EMISSIONS TO FIGHT CLIMATE CHANGE, KEEPING COSTS LOW AND ENSURING RELIABLE SUPPLY DURING THE TRANSITION. WANT TO BRING IN KEVIN MARTIN. NOW HE HEADS AN ASSOCIATION OF LARGE ENERGY USERS, WHICH, OF COURSE, HAS A BIG BALL IN THIS GAME. SO KEVIN, DO WE HAVE WILL WE HAVE UNDER THIS PLAN ENOUGH ENERGY CAPACITY GOING FORWARD, PARTICULARLY FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT IN THE EASTERN PART OF THE STATE. >> WELL, I THINK THAT THIS PLAN AND HAS BEEN SAID EARLIER. THERE'S A LOT OF FLEXIBILITY AND THIS IS A COMPLEX ISSUE. AND SO IT'S A WORK IN PROGRESS AND SO WHEN WE WILL SEE. JUST LIKE WE'VE SEEN EVENTS RECENTLY. THERE'S THERE'S BEEN A LOT ON THE COURAGE THAT IS IT'S VERY VULNERABLE TO 2 DIFFERENT CONDITIONS THAT INCLUDES DIFFERENT CUSTOMER CONDITIONS AS WELL AS WEATHER CONDITIONS. THERE'S ALSO A LOT OF MODELING IN THIS PLAN. SO AND WE RELY HEAVILY ON A LOT OF MODELING. WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT MODELING IS AS ACCURATE AS AS POSSIBLE. SO WE ALL HOPE THAT THERE'S ENOUGH CAPACITY THERE. THE CAPACITY ISSUES THAT WE ARE CONCERNED ABOUT IN MANUFACTURING OR ARE THE NATURAL GAS CAPACITIES. ONE PIPELINE. SO IN 5 THAT SUPPLIES 3 STATES. WE DON'T HAVE ANY OTHER PIPELINE. SO ANYTHING THAT GETS ADDED IN THE NATURAL GAS SIDE OF THE HOUSE. WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT THE INDUSTRY'S AND NO RESIDENTIAL CUSTOMERS ARE NOT IMPACTED BY BY THOSE ADDITIONS. >> WHY IS NATURAL STICK WITH YOU HERE, KEVIN. SO IMPORTANT IN MANUFACTURING THAT IT WHAT? WHY DON'T WE HAVE SOLAR PANELS ON TOP OF EVERY LARGE BUILDING. YOU KNOW, EVERY EVERYWHERE, HOUSE. WHY ISN'T THAT SIMPLE? >> MANUFACTURES TYPICALLY OPERATE AROUND THE CLOCK SO THAT AND THERE ALSO. TRANSFORMING RAW MATERIALS INTO THE NEXT. INTO THE NEXT PIECES OF THE PUZZLE IN THE SUPPLY CHAIN. AND IN THAT TRANSFORMATION PROCESS, THEY OFTEN NEED. HE LOADS AND THEY USE PROCESSES THAT CAN ALL BE ELECTRIFIED. SO HAVING THAT, THAT DIRECT FIRE. OPPORTUNITY FOR EVERYBODY TO YOU AT THE BURNER TIP, IS IS ESSENTIAL NOW THAT BEING SAID, YOU KNOW, WHERE WE'RE USING AT A AT A HIGH RATE WHERE THE SCALE IS IS EXTREMELY LARGE. LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T UNDERSTAND THE FULL SCALE. SOME OF THE MANUFACTURING OPERATIONS. SOMETIMES OTHER OTHER SOURCES DON'T PROVIDE ALL OF THE SCALE AS WELL AS THE TIMING MEANS FOR THE CAPACITY THAT THAT WE NEED FOR THE AROUND THE CLOCK OPERATION. WE ALSO FOCUS ON THE OVERALL RELIABILITY AND THE COSTS. AND AS WE DO THAT, TOO, THE COSTS ALSO HELP THE REST OF THE GRID AS WELL. >> ASKING ABOUT COST. TURNING TO YOU ON THIS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT HAPPENS WHEN THE UTILITIES COMMISSION DECIDES AN ISSUE LIKE THIS IS THAT BASICALLY THERE'S A COURT TRIAL WHERE EVERYONE MAKES THEIR ARGUMENTS AND WITNESS FOR GOOGLE AND APPLE AND SOME OTHER TECH COMPANIES THAT OPERATE IN STATE SUGGESTED THAT DUKE DIDN'T ACCURATELY REFLECT THE COST OF NEW NATURAL GAS. THE COST OF BUILDING THESE PLANTS. D DO YOU FEEL LIKE DUKE ENERGY LOWBALL NATURAL GAS COSTS AS THIS PLANNING PROCESS WAS ONGOING? >> I THINK IT'S IT'S A VERY CHALLENGING THING ALL. I THINK PART OF WHAT HAPPENED IS YOU DO PRESENTED ITS PROPOSALS IN MAY. >> BASED ON WORK IT HAD DONE IN THE MONTHS LEADING UP TO THAT. >> AND THEN WE HAVE THESE SPIKES AND NATURAL GAS PRICES. YOU KNOW, AFTER SOME OF THE MODELING THAT THEY HAD CONDUCTED. AND THOSE PRICES HAVE CONTINUED TO BE HIGH AND VOLATILE. SO I THINK A PIECE OF THAT IS JUST THE INHERENT UNPREDICTABILITY OF THOSE FUTURE FUEL COSTS. I THINK ANOTHER IN HORTON ASPECT OF THIS IS DUKE'S MODELING ASSUMES THAT AT SOME POINT IN THE FUTURE, THESE GAS-FIRED POWER PLANTS ARE GOING TO BE CONVERTED TO WRITE OFF HYDROGEN. AND THERE'S WHERE THE COSTS ARE REALLY ON WE HAVEN'T BUILT A HYDROGEN INFRASTRUCTURE THAT WOULD SUPPORT IT. BURNING IN COMBUSTION TURBINES AND THAT'S I THINK ONE OF THE REAL BIG UNKNOWNS WILL VIE SHOULD BE AVAILABLE, WILL BURNING AT IN POWER PLANTS BE ITS BEST USE WILL NOT BE A COST-EFFECTIVE SOLUTION TO MEETING OUR ENERGY NEEDS. AND I THINK THAT'S WHERE SOME OF THEIR SOME DISAGREEMENTS ABOUT SOME OF THE ASSUMPTIONS THAT DUKE USING THAT MODEL LYING ABOUT FUTURE HYDROGEN INFRASTRUCTURE COSTS. >> ALL RIGHT. WE'RE GOING TO TAKE ONE MORE BREAK HERE. AND I WANT TO REMIND FOLKS, WE DIDN'T BY DUKE ENERGY TO PARTICIPATE IN THIS CONVERSATION. THEY DECLINED. WHEN WE COME WE WILL TALK MORE ABOUT NATURAL GAS. WE'LL TALK AB

Travis Fain

On the Record: The future of energy in NC

On the record: Experts sit down to talk about unconstitutional partisan voting maps

Duke Energy,On the Record,WRAL specialists,energy,renewable energy

WRAL-TV News Broadcasts: Watch each newscast live or watch the most recent newscast on demand.

WRAL Late News 

Get the latest WRAL WeatherCenter Forecast whenever you need it, including the DUALDoppler5000 and the 7-Day Forecast.

I'm meteorologist, Amy Wilmuth in the WRL severe weather center. We've had some good rain today and we'll still have rain through the evening, but then just some light spotty showers overnight tonight. But we'll have another round of showers and storms move in from the south as we head into tomorrow afternoon and tomorrow evening. But so far today, it's just been some light to moderate rain, some very good rain that we really need across central North Carolina. Looking ahead to Win Day in the morning, it looks mainly cloudy. It looks like it should be a dry morning, commute, only a slim chance for a shower during the morning commute. So we'll probably be ok when we're walking out the door in the morning, but make sure to take the umbrella with you. We'll have some scattered storms in the afternoon. Everyone under a level one risk for severe storms. And for the evening, we'll still have some storms around and some of those storms could be severe with some gusty winds, some brief heavy rain and maybe some small hail. So here's a look at the timeline, hour by hour. Notice the rain chances Wednesday morning are just a 20% chance. So most of you will be dry in the morning. But then as we get into the afternoon and evening hours, rain, chances really start to go up and we'll have several scattered showers and thunderstorms during the afternoon and evening hours. We'll take a look at this with futurecast this evening. A few lingering showers will be possible late this evening. And then overnight tonight, just a stray spotty shower too. Wednesday morning, it's cloudy. We can't rule out an isolated shower but nothing widespread. And then by lunchtime, we're noticing a few storms starting to form down to the south, but many will be dry at noon on Wednesday. Once we get beyond noon, we'll have hit and miss showers and storms around and any of the storms that do form could become severe with some strong winds and small hail that will continue through the evening, commute on Wednesday and into Wednesday night. Here's a look at the severe risk for Wednesday. It is a level one risk for everyone. With the biggest threats being some damaging winds and some small hail over the next seven days to look at how much rain we could get anywhere from an inch to close to two inches in some spots. So we still have some more rain headed this way and some of that impacting us tomorrow, especially in the afternoon and evening, high temperatures will be a little bit warmer tomorrow. We'll climb into the upper seventies during the afternoon. Thursday. We have some improvements. We'll have partly cloudy skies should stay dry with highs near 8082 on Friday with just a slim chance for rain during the day. A better chance for rain during the evening and night time hours. We'll have some scattered storms on Saturday and still a few storms Sunday, but looking fairly dry for Monday and Tuesday.

WRAL WeatherCenter Forecast

Daytime Pick 3 and Pick 4 drawings are held at 3 p.m. daily. They can be seen as live or on-demand video.

Hey there. Good afternoon to you. I'm Noah Klein. Welcome to this afternoon. Joins for Tuesday, May 14th, 2024. Let's get started here with Carolina pick three. That first pick three number is three. Second number is one third number is five, pick three. Fireball number is six. Joining me for this afternoon's drawing is our auditor from mcconnell and Jones L LP. Now let's move to the Carolina pick four. That first pick four. Number is zero. Second number zero. Third number five, fourth number is eight pick four. Fireball number is, is seven. The North Carolina education lottery contribute over $10 billion education. Thank you for your support. You get your warning numbers each day at 3 p.m. Again, 11 to 2 p.m. right here on your exclusive station for the lottery.

Daytime Pick 3 and Pick 4 Drawing

Nightly N.C. Education Lottery drawings during the 11 p.m. News.

Good evening. I'm Gayle. Her, welcome to tonight's drawing. So Monday, May 13th 2024. Well, let's start tonight with our Carolina pick three. Our first winning number is an eight. Our second number is six and the third number tonight is one and our pick three. Fireball number is six. Joining me for tonight's drawing is our from M Connolly Jones L LP. Now let's move to the Carolina pick four. Good luck. Everyone who's that first winning pick four number, it's a three. Our second number is one third number one again and our fourth number is N eight in our pick four fireball number. There it is, it is a six. We'll turn now to the Carolina cash five. I'm going with the top prize tonight. Tomorrow's top prize is estimated at $1.1 million. Good luck. Everyone who's that first winning cash five number, it's 18. Our second number four, third number tonight is 32. Our fourth number is sweet 16. And the final number NRC five this evening is eight. The North Carolina education lottery has contributed over $10 billion to education. Get your winning numbers right here every night. In your exclusive station for the North Carolina Education lottery. Thanks for playing. Have a great night.

Evening Pick 3 Pick 4 and Cash 5

Monday, Wednesday, and Saturday Powerball drawings, as shown live on WRAL.

Favorite jackpot game. This is Powerball. Good evening America. I'm Laura Johnson. Tonight we have another life changing jackpot for you. It's worth an estimated $47.9 million. So, get those tickets out. Let's play that first number up is 14, followed by the number five. Tonight, we're gonna meet Lisa Hayes who won $2 million playing powerball. Congratulations Lisa. Now, for the rest of those numbers, we've got 2938 rounding it out with 66. Your powerball number tonight. Good luck. Everyone is one and your power play multiplier is two. Let's take a look at those numbers. One last time. Remember there are multiple ways to win. We'll see you back here Wednesday night. Good night everyone. It's time to play America's favorite jackpot.

Powerball Drawing

Durham County commissioners are presenting their proposed budget for the county for the 2025 fiscal year.

Durham County commissioners present budget proposal for 2025 fiscal year

Community members and loved ones of fallen law enforcement officers come together in Raleigh to remember and honor heroes for their service and sacrifices.

Here. She is Miss Judy. Thank you so much. I personally want to thank you for all that you have done at this time. I invite everyone to stand with me and please remain standing for the posting of the colors by our Wake County multi-agency color guard and remain standing for the national anthem sung by Raleigh Police Department. Senior Officer Kendall Strong followed by the invocation by Reverend Sarah Meares. I er no, that's oh, say can you see by the dawn's early light? What so proudly we hail at the twilights and last gleaming whose broad stripes and bright stars through the pear road was for the parts we watch were some gling streaming in the rockets red, the bombs bursting GP pro through the night that a flag was still there. Who say does that star spangled? And we for the and of the free? Yeah. Ok. Mhm. Officer at this time, we will have the invocation by Reverend Sarah Meares. Ok. Please pray with me, loving and gracious God as we gather together in this sacred hour. We are assured once more of your presence among us, we know that you are with us as you have been and will always continue to be in moments of loss and heartache, in moments of joy and remembrance in every mountain top and valley of our lives. You walk beside us. And so we come today asking that you cover us once more with your mercy, grace and love as we remember and honor those who served and paid the ultimate sacrifice to care for us and to keep us safe. We are here to honor husbands, wives, mothers, fathers, sons, daughters, neighbors, colleagues and friends. We are grieving, but we are thankful oh God for their lives and the legacies they leave. We are thankful for their service, dedication to this community, strength, courage and care. Your word reminds us that there is no greater love than this to lay down one's life for his friends. We are deeply grateful and we will not forget. We ask that you keep their families and friends in your loving, embrace, comfort, their broken hearts, give them peace that can only come from you, guide them in their grief and help them to feel your presence. May they feel your love and compassion and be encouraged, knowing their loved one's legacy will not be forgotten. May today honor the lives lost and the dedication and service to this community. And may you be present in every moment leading us comforting us and challenging us to honor their memories and sacrifice in every day of our own lives in Jesus. Name we pray. Amen. Thank you, Reverend Meares for that very heartfelt prayer. This time you may be seated. It is now my pleasure to introduce our keynote speaker, Attorney General, Josh Stein, who is both a friend of to law enforcement and a fierce advocate for justice for every North Carolinian in our state. Josh Stein was sworn in for his first term as Attorney General in 2017 and his second term in 2021 he is focused on protecting North Carolina families from crime and consumer fraud. He diligently works to keep communities safe by recruiting and retaining well trained law enforcement officers. He also works to keep Children safe online, improve data security and lead a national effort to combat robocalls. Attorney General Stein is also leading efforts to combat the opioid crisis and bring treatment and recovery resources to North Carolinians struggling from drug addiction. He is working to make North Carolina's law enforcement and criminal justice systems fair and fighting the teen vaping epidemic all the while he's taken measures to protect clean air and water for our environment. Attorney General Stein previously served as a state senator and senior deputy attorney general in the North Carolina Department of Justice. He has led the efforts to put more violent criminals behind bars by expanding the state's DNA database. He uh he has also wrote the School Safety Act and the Identify the Identity Theft Protection Act and he has worked to protect kids from online sexual predators. It is my distinct pleasure and my honor to introduce North Carolina, Attorney General Josh Stein. Thank you, Chief Patterson. Good morning. Everyone I want to recognize and thank, uh, Sheriff Rowe, Chief Penry, uh, Reverend Meares, and of course, Chief Patterson, and we're grateful to Doctor Haley and Hayes Barton Baptist Church for hosting us this morning. And from the for to the Raleigh Youth Choir who will be participating shortly. It's an honor to be with you as we remember, heroes who have fallen in the line of duty here in Wake County to offer our praise and gratitude for their service to mourn their loss and to stand with their colleagues and families who've been forced to pay a heavy toll. Wake County has been my home now for three decades, I love living here. My wife Anna and I have raised our three Children here. They all went to public schools here. We work and worship here. Our neighbors are kind and thoughtful and I am so grateful and honored to be able to call Wake County home. Part of what makes this such a wonderful community is the commitment of our local police and deputies to keeping us safe. I thank them for their service to protect the people of Wake County. We make an enormous ask of peace officers. We ask them to fulfill a high calling which is to run straight to the very threat that every human instinct is telling them to go the other way to go toward the danger so that we and our loved ones can sleep safely in our homes at night. Our Children can be safe at school or at play. Being a peace officer is hard work, dangerous work, often underappreciated work. But my goodness, it is important and meaningful work. Every officer makes a choice to enter this field even though they understand the perils that may lay ahead. But they do so anyway, because they are heroes in life just as some are heroes in death. And unfortunately, we've been reminded all too recently of the sacrifices that some make. We've only just buried the four law enforcement officers we lost in tragedy in Charlotte. Their loved ones shared memories and painted portraits of officers who in and out of uniform were stand up. People looked out for others and acted with dignity and bravery. This past Tuesday, we commemorated North Carolina Peace Officer Memorial Day in Statesville. We recognized four other officers from across the state, including Raleigh Police Department's own Gabriel Jesus Torres. I want to say a word to the family members here today of the wake County officers who've lost because we know that fallen officers do not sacrifice alone. You all do as well. You were forced to wake up the next day and every day after and pick up the pieces of your lives and move forward without your loved one beside you. I'm incredibly sorry for the losses you've suffered. May the memories of your loved ones be a blessing to you today and always you played an integral role in nurturing the flame of service that burned within these fallen officers. Your support, your patience, your faith, your bravery, your love were sources of strength that supported their bravery and heroism. Thank you from the bottom of my heart. And now it's up to the rest of us to surround you with the love and support that you so deserve. I hope and pray that we fulfill this responsibility to you and to this brotherhood and sisterhood of officers who've lost friends and coworkers from your ranks. I offer my condolences to you as well. I can't presume to imagine what it must feel like to lose a colleague in uniform. But I know well, what it means to lose someone you love and care about a friend, a colleague, a mentor. I pray that the bonds among you sustain you in sorrow and in your service and the legacies of those we've lost con continue to inspire you. Today is a testament to the immense gratitude that we have for all of you and the sacrifices you make on this job for the people that you serve and protect you all are the embodiment of strength and courage. It is right and good to thank and honor you all. Both the officers here with us today and the officers we have lost. There is no shortage of challenges facing our communities today. And in almost every instance, law enforcement officers are on the front lines of our community's response to those challenges. We call on them to make a measurable number of sacrifices as our guardians. And in the most tragic of these circumstances, they make the ultimate sacrifice. No amount of thanks can repay the debt we owe them. So we must resolve to stand tall and stay strong, to watch out for each other and care for each other to do our part, to make our community safer and stronger and to live up the le to the legacies of the fallen. Thank you all. And may God hold you all closely. Thank you, Attorney General Stein for those inspiring words and thank you so much for always being a partner to law enforcement. At this time. We will have a musical selection from our Raleigh youth choir. Yeah. Ok. Wow, that was wonderful. So good to see our young men singing and doing something positive at this time. With all law enforcement officers stand with me as we prepare for the reading of the names of our fallen heroes, guests and family. You may remain seated. I invite all. I invite Wake County Sheriff, Willie Rowe to come to the podium for the roll call of names following the roll call. Please remain standing for the 21 gun salute and the playing of taps. Sure fro ok. Ok. Thomas J Crabtree Raleigh Police Department in the Watch. September 1st 1922 Guy Cecil Massey, senior Wake County Sheriff's office. End of March. September 10th, 1933. Ok, John L Taylor Wake Forest Police Department. End of Watch. May 30th 1944 George C Mitchell Wake Forest Police Department. End of March. April 26th, 1947 Robert Earl Sparks Raleigh Police Department end of March March 8th, 1968 James Gail Lee Raleigh Police Department end of March December 5th, 1968 James Wade Allen Raleigh Police Department end of watch December 5th, 1968. Mm, Robert Randall East, North Carolina State highway patrolled end of March, December 21st, 1972 Del Mar D, Adams Raleigh Police Department end of Watch, February 3rd, 1980 Coen Low Wake Forest Police Department end of March, February 26th, 1984. We Bayless the third, North Carolina State Highway patrol. End of March February 5th, 1988 Denise Holden Raleigh Police Department end of March August 4th, 1995 William Earl Godwin Marsel Police Department. End of March May 22nd, 1997 Paul Andrew Hale Raleigh Police Department end of March, July 11th, 1997 Charles Radford, Paul the third Raleigh Police Department end of March, September 10th, 2002, William Franklin James, the second Wake County Sheriff's office end of March September 5th, 2003, Phil Owens Wake County Sheriff's Office End of March October 2nd 2003, Mark Reed Tucker. Wake County Sheriff's office end of March, February 12th, 2004 and drew Stocks, North Carolina State Highway patrol. End of March September 9th, 2008, Stephan, Maurice Wall. Wake County Sheriff's office end of March, April 22nd, 2018, Ryan A Hayworth night, Dale Police Department. End of March October 17th, 2021. NED P by Wake County Sheriff's Office. End of March, August 11th, 2022 Gabriel Jesus Torres Raleigh Police Department end of March October 13th, 2022 K nine, Santos Wake County Sheriff's office end of March May 26th, 2023. Ready. Hey, no. Hey, no. Hey, thanks. Yeah. Yeah. Ok. Officers please. We will now have another musical selection from our amazing Raleigh youth choir. All they are. They Move Me up, all they are. Yeah. Hallelujah. Hallelujah H 01 on Hallelujah. Hallelujah. Yeah. Halle. Halle, we are there. Go here, you know, other than God and they do me up. Yeah, we have all that. We have truly amazing what a solemn yet joyous occasion. This has been to celebrate the lives of our fallen brothers, sisters and canine partner. Scripture reminds us that in our sufferings, there is glory because suffering produces perseverance, perseverance, produces character and character encourages hope. And we know that hope maketh not a shame. Sometimes the truths of these words are difficult to understand and even consume. But let me assure you that the losses we have suffered in the deaths of our heroes whose names were read today are not in vain. Each loss has produced incredible strength and a perseverance that builds character and hope for a better tomorrow. Subsequently, those of us who are still standing, have a responsibility and the awesome privilege of carrying the legacy of each of the fallen officers by fulfilling what they all loved so dearly. And that was serving their community. Let us leave today with a renewed energy and desire to give a little bit more for the betterment of the whole. We live in a wonderful county where at least the 65 people who are moving here daily thinks that this region is the finest the state has to offer and we have a duty to protect and serve with the same valor enthusiasm, integrity and selfless service of our fallen comrades. The mantle has been passed on to us to continue the good fight that keeps the scales of justice balanced, to close out this wonderful service. I invite you to stand to your feet for the benediction by wake Tech police chief Michael Penry and the retiring of the colors. OK. Scripture reads in Psalm 46. God is our refuge and strength, an ever present help in the time of trouble. Therefore, we will not fear though the earth give way and the mountains fall into the heart of the sea, though its waters roar and foam and the mountains quake with surging the Lord Almighty is with us. The God of Jacob is our fortress. Would you pray with me? Lord? Anytime we lose a law enforcement officer in the line of duty, it seems like the storms of life rage. It seems as though mountains crumble and seas roar and um and everything is, is out of control. But God, you are a refuge and you are our strength and you are with us and you are our fortress. So God, I pray that in these times uh of remembrance that you would overwhelm us with comfort and strength and compassion. Lord, for the families of those that have lost loved ones in the line of duty. I know that some grief comes like waves over and over and lord I pray that they would seek you for strength and refuge. We thank you for this opportunity. We have to remember those who gave all in the, in their line of duty. And Lord, we will always remember them and recognize them. And may we live out the courage that they lived before us? Lord, we love you. It's in jesus' name that we pray. Amen. Opposite. Yeah. Yeah. OK. Thank you for joining us today. And I'd like to extend a special thank you to our Special Operations Division for putting everything together so well and so amazingly, they had me a little bit worried but they did a fantastic job. So thank you for that. I do invite you to please remain with us and in your seats while our guests exit the stage along with the families of our heroes and then our command staff and we invite everyone to a special lunch, lunch, and reception. We have for the families to support you in your loss. We, our ushers will be available to direct you where to go for that and family. We really want you to be there with us. So if you are able to stay for that special luncheon, we appreciate it greatly. Thank you all again for being here and God bless you. Yeah. Ok. Ok. Yeah. Yeah, it's ok. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Ok.

Remembering heroes: 23 fallen officers honored in Raleigh

Karen Brinson Bell, executive director of the State Board of Elections, explains preparations for North Carolina's second primary, a runoff with four races on the ballot. Polls will be open Tuesday from 6:30 a.m. to 7:30 p.m.

<p>I'm Karen Brinson Bell, executive director of the State board of Elections. I'm here with Paul Cox, our general counsel to the state board. Thank you to all the members of the press in attendance for helping us to get accurate information to the public. Tomorrow. Tuesday, May 14th is the second primary election day in North Carolina. There are two statewide Republican second primaries on the ballot tomorrow. State Auditor and Lieutenant governor to be eligible to vote in those contests. You must either be a registered Republican or an unaffiliated voter who either did not vote in the March 5th primary election or voted the Republican ballot in the primary. The winners of these contests will be the Republican nominees in the November general election. Also on ballots in some locations. Tomorrow are a Republican second primary in the 13th congressional district as well as local contests in Gaston and Orange counties. Tomorrow is the last opportunity for registered and eligible voters to cast their ballot in this election election day. Polling places will be open statewide from 6:30 a.m. to 7:30 p.m. Voters should go to their assigned voting location. You can find your assigned voting location and your sample ballot in the voter search tool. On the state board's website N CS ve.gov, some election day voting sites have been consolidated for the second primary. So please make sure to confirm the location of your election day poll in place through the voter search tool. Another important reminder, voters will be asked to show a photo ID. When they check in to vote, most voters will simply show their driver's license but there are many other acceptable forms of photo id for more information including the full list of acceptable I DS visit, bring it nc.gov. If a voter cannot show a photo ID, they can still vote by filling out an ID exception form and voting a provisional ballot. Finally, a crucial reminder to absentee voters. If you still want to vote your absentee ballot, your only option is to drop off your ballot at your county board of elections office by 7:30 p.m. Tomorrow. Today is too late to put that ballot in the mail. It must arrive at your county board of elections office by 7:30 p.m. tomorrow. As an alternative, you can still, you can simply discard your absentee ballot and vote in person at your assigned voting location tomorrow. So how will results get reported? Unofficial election results will be posted as they come in tomorrow night on the state Board's elections, dashboard results dashboard as always just remember, elections are not over on election night during the 10 day canvas period after election day, bipartisan county boards of elections in all 100 counties count the remaining absentee ballots, research and count provisional ballots, audit the results and conduct any necessary recount. For example, every county conducts a sample hand count of ballots in randomly selected election day precincts, early voting sites or the absentee ballots cast in the county. Even during second primaries, we do this with every election. This process is to confirm results tabulated by our certified and tested voting equipment. Counties must conduct these hand counts in public. Finally, I just want to tell voters all voters in North Carolina who are eligible to vote in the Republican second primary that there is still time to make your voice heard all too often. We see low turnout in second primary elections. Yet votes cast in these contests will decide the nominees of the Republican party for the general election in these particular contests. So get out there and vote. And with that, I will take your questions, please put your name and media organization in the chat if you wish to ask a question. All righty. Uh looks like Michael Highland was first, Michael, go ahead and unmute. And are you able to hear me? Ok, I can hear you. Ok, great. Um My first question related to what you just said at the end about the um history of the low turnout in these um second primaries. Um What if anything do you think the state could do, are there any steps you think could be taken to help improve turnout in these, uh, second primaries if we're gonna continue to have them? I don't tend to weigh in on that. Um, but I'm happy to talk to legislators. It did actually come up um, briefly in a question from a legislator, uh, during the joint elections committee meeting recently and there are options. Um, we have adjusted this law in the past. Um And I think, you know, that's something that legislators can consider. Um And, and determine whether a second primary method is the right path for North Carolinians or not. Um And then are there any um recommendations for counties who may be concerned about the cost of doing this with seeing so few people turn out any other things that maybe could be done to help with that? Uh The, the cost of elections by our state law is the responsibility of the counties. Um You know, that might be something else. Uh There's different methods of who pays for primaries and second primaries and runoffs in other states. So that would be something we need to look at from a legislative standpoint and happy to discuss with uh our lawmakers on how those methods and, and processes work in other states. Um So, yeah, but at this point, you know what we do, whether it's a second primary or a general election, whatever the case, we prepare for 100% turnout and um and hope that we will see that kind of turnout, whether it's a second primary or a presidential general election. Laura Leslie. Uh You should be unmuted. Can you hear me? Ok. Hi Laura. Hey. Um, so couple questions. Number one, what was our turnout for the prime for the uh first primary? Uh We were at about 24% if I remember correctly. What do we average for a second primary? Uh, second primary or of far too often in single digits? It does certainly depend on what might be happening in a local contest. Like we've got going on in Orange and Gaston counties or, uh, we'll probably see a higher turnout in the counties with the 13th congressional district. Um, but overall statewide, we're at about 0.7% turnout for those voters who are eligible, which is about, uh, uh, not quite 5 million eligible voters considering the unaffiliated and the Republican, uh, voters, you're saying so far so far? That's right. Hopefully that goes up tomorrow. We don't see people turn out. All right. Um, ok. So another question, um, what do people do if they are one of those folks who has gotten delayed getting their driver's license because of the glitch that's happening at the DMV. So, say you've got a paper driver's license. How do you vote? There's actually an exception for that on the exception form. So we could, um, help them that way or potentially they may have another acceptable form of ID. Um, you know, there are many student I DS that are acceptable public, uh, employee I DS that are permitted tribal veteran I DS passports. Um, so there are options and that's why we definitely encourage voters to look at our website. And the list of I DS that are acceptable, uh, bring it nc.gov is the site for that. And again, if it's this particular case where they have not gotten their ID from the DMV, at this point in time, that is a, uh, an exception on the exception form as well. Great. Thank you. Um, and just real quickly, do we know that is Jennifer Moore withdrawn from the primary in Orange County? Um, she's actually uh past the point to withdrawal, um, but she has resigned. So, uh, we have a situation where she will appear on the ballot. The ballots had already gone out. Um Similarly, we have an indication from the 13th congressional district that the, one of the candidates does not, you know, intend to continue. Um, but the ballots had already gone out in both of these situations. So, um, that, that process will, you know, continue, those votes will be counted. Um If, if those individuals um happen to be the top vote getters, then we'll address that with them and, and how they choose to continue. So there's nothing but there's nothing like if you go to an election site, right? You go to, to tomorrow on election day, there's no signs or anything that are telling you that that one of these people is no longer running. That's correct. They have announced that, but they, um, they, they could not withdraw at the point when they made that announcement, Paul, is there anything from a legal standpoint? You want to add in on that? No, I think you said it correctly. I mean, at this point, um, our law requires that the election continue as is and that the results be declared. Uh And because the, the Orange County contest is not a primary contest, it's like the actual election, the, the, the run off to determine who's going to take office. So whoever is the highest vote earner in that runoff contest will be declared the new, um, uh person who's eligible to assume office for that Board of Education seat in Orange County. And then it'd be up to that person whether to assume that office just like it is for anyone who's elected. And if they don't, then it'd be up to the Board of Education to um, uh fill that vacancy if, if no one takes office once they're elected. Thank you. Uh Gary Robertson should be able to unmute and ask your question. I can hear you. Gary, let's, it's a little static. Let's see. OK. I wanted to ask, I was intrigued by the idea that there are some counties where precincts have been consolidated for the second primary. How, how is that accomplished? And is that a potential solution for counties to deal with second runoff expenses in the future? It's actually a, a practice that in my 18 years of working in elections administration, uh that we've seen this practice has gone on um for some time when we have second primaries where we anticipate a lower turnout or even in municipal elections, when there are fewer eligible voters, we can consolidate. Um There's a provision within the law about, you know, uh the, the locations being adjacent, the precincts being adjacent to each other, so that we're not um you know, creating a burden for someone to have to travel across the county. It's not that level of consolidation, but nearby precincts can be consolidated. Um The boards had to take action on that and notice to the voters that were affected. Um So it, it's, it's something that's um we've approved many weeks ago actually, I guess you could say um almost months ago, um as the, they rolled into the second primary to be prepared. And um and, and it does help to reduce costs. We still um are able to uh identify uh the ballots cast by precinct um because we still, the voters are still registered with the precinct that they um you know, their boundaries uh where they belong. Um But we are able to use a uh a consolidated polling site Thank you. All right. I see a couple of hands raised. Um, I'm gonna get to you all. First, Lisa Worf. Do you have a question? How many fewer, uh, polling sites are you expecting in the second primary compared to the, the first one?</p>

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