This story is closed for comments. Comments on WRAL.com news stories are accepted and moderated between the hours of 8 a.m. and 8 p.m. Monday through Friday.

Oldest First
  • junkmail5 Jan 22, 12:33 p.m.

    There are OLD guns that can go off if you drop em (or possibly slam it down on a table hard, which is possible here)... which is yet another good reason not to transport them loaded like this guy did.

    Just about anything made even vaguely recently would have a number of safety features to make that impossible though.

  • gregbscis Jan 22, 11:38 a.m.

    Whoever discharged the weapon is the one at fault or both are at fault if there is a rule regarding weapons need to be unloaded prior to showing up at the Gun Show. Remember Firearm handling rule number #1.

    "Regardless of its true state, GUNS ARE ALWAYS LOADED!!!!"

  • Lightfoot3 Jan 22, 11:24 a.m.

    "A gun doesn't just "Go off" that trigger had to have been pulled by someone." - heat764


    Well, we use to have an old 16ga single shot that didn't need a trigger pull. All you had to do was think about it. "Hey, is that shotgun in the closet?" BOOM! Seriously though, you could could pull back the hammer, then just bump the stock on the floor and it would fire. My Grandpa found the shotgun in a ditch somewhere, many moons ago. My brother has it now.

  • Lightfoot3 Jan 22, 11:19 a.m.

    "firstly it rarely happens" - Grand Union


    Wrong. It happens thousands upon thousands of times, even in our local WRAL arena. You ignore it because it goes against your religion.


    "its impossible to prove that it ever happens" - Grand Union


    People can use the same flawed and warped logic to say we shouldn't have any gun regulations because you can't prove all the shootings from here on out will be deadly.


    "data that shows that owning a gun makes you 3X more likely to get shot than not owning one." - Grand Union


    Incorrect. Well, I guess I should say that the "data" is incorrect. It might show it, but it's flawed and full of errors, which has been pointed out to you many times before. But such is the nature of religion.

  • Lightfoot3 Jan 22, 11:18 a.m.

    "really what are the odds of you ever needing an AR-15 to fight of bad guy with AK??????" - Grand Union


    Specifically against an AK? Probably not very high. But used in common house defense, about the same as any other gun.


    "are those odds worth one kids life let alone 20????" - Grand Union


    First you're talking odds, now you're talking numbers. Can't do that. You also have to express the odds of a kid getting shot with an AR-15.


    "LOl a lot more people go to the state fair than to your hobby show so it may well be that this one incident makes you statistically more at risk that at the fair." - Grand Union


    They have multiple shows. At least EIGHT scheduled for 2013. What numbers did you use for your calculations? And are you factoring in all the incidents at the State Fair? The stabbings, etc.?

  • heat764 Jan 22, 10:38 a.m.

    A gun doesn't just "Go off" that trigger had to have been pulled by someone. So was it the retired cop who pulled the trigger? I'm sure the retired cop won't be charged with anything even if it was his fault. Probably the guy who showed up with it loaded will get nailed to the wall. Because we all know cops aren't guilty right? its evil gun owners who should suffer right?

  • joeBob Jan 22, 8:06 a.m.

    According to some eye witnesses to the event, the retired (but in uniform?) cop pulled the trigger. The truth is out there somewhere. Also, GRNC points out that the mgmt and security at the NC State Fairgrounds had no authority to close the show or disallow people bringing in their guns for show or sale.

  • junkmail5 Jan 22, 8:02 a.m.

    according to N.C. Gen. Stat. 14-402(a) it is a Class 2 Misdemeanor for anyone to transfer ownership of a handgun..including inherited...without a permit issued by the Sheriff's Dept. unless the person purchasing has a concealed carry permit.-dsalter

    Yes... a _handgun_... which I already mentioned like 3 times. That's a state, not federal, requirement so it's only true in NC (and a handfull of other states with state-level laws on this)
    All OTHER guns there's no check, and no paperwork, whatsoever, required for private sale.

    Junkmail, they don't market guns for self protection?- Bill Brasky
    Sure, which is STOPPING OTHERS FROM KILLING YOU. Just like cars kill lots of people with their size, but they market the size as making YOU safer.

    There are laws depending on what town you are in-Bill Brasky

    Really? Again, show me where private personal pools (which are most of em) require lifeguards. You can't of course- so why are you against banning pools, since they kill more than ARs do?

  • robjustrob Jan 21, 7:58 p.m.

    Saturday's incident did widescale damage and set back the gun rights movement. First and foremost, three persons were injured. Inexcusable! And now, the media frenzy. We have CNN to capitalize on the misfortune of those three. We have Bloomberg and the Prezzydent looking down their noses at us NCarolinians as if we were a bunch of yahoos. If I were a rich northern politician, I'd be paying people to do these things.

  • chrisnrali Jan 21, 7:25 p.m.

    Here's your sign.

  • Bill Brasky Jan 21, 7:25 p.m.

    "They are trained by the military, and these weapons are checked for ownership yearly by the government, they cannot sell these weapons."

    If the US had these same guidelines as the Swiss do I'd have no problem with assault weapons...call that a compromise.

  • Bill Brasky Jan 21, 7:14 p.m.

    "As long as they are in the military, which 100's of thousands of the Swiss are, their guns are FULLY automatic, and from what I saw, they are kept in the home in a hall closet. When they leave, they are gifted by their government with a semi automatic military style assault rifle. And for some odd reason,they are not inclined to mow each other down. I wonder why that is."

    They are trained by the military, and these weapons are checked for ownership yearly by the government, they cannot sell these weapons.

  • dsalter Jan 21, 7:03 p.m.

    "When a transaction takes place between private (unlicensed) persons who reside in the same State, the Gun Control Act (GCA) does not require any record keeping. A private person may sell a firearm to another private individual in his or her State of residence and, similarly, a private individual may buy a firearm from another private person who resides in the same State."

    According to N.C. Gen. Stat. 14-402(a) it is a Class 2 Misdemeanor for anyone to transfer ownership of a handgun..including inherited...without a permit issued by the Sheriff's Dept. unless the person purchasing has a concealed carry permit.

  • Bill Brasky Jan 21, 7:03 p.m.

    "I don't have to explain myself to anyone as this is a free country but for your edification I'm Scots with dual US, UK citizenship. I've lived in both countries for many years."

    "Please do not try to force your UK ideas on us."

    We Americans can't stand that whole reasoning thing.

  • Bill Brasky Jan 21, 6:54 p.m.

    Junkmail, they don't market guns for self protection?....Interesting
    http://www.motherjones.com/media/2012/12/gun-ads-bushmaster-mattel

    "Can you show me the law that requires that for private pools? (which is most of them)"

    There are laws depending on what town you are in. Some laws require a fence, some require that the pool walls cannot be higher then 6 feet. Other laws, Nonslip treads and handrails on stairs and steps.. All in an attempt to limit drownings.

    Your car comparison is horrible as well. We use 250 million cars nearly everyday for transportation. In comparison, most guns are rarely used if ever and still result in nearly 10,000 deaths a year.

  • Bartmeister Jan 21, 6:46 p.m.

    I was at the show and left about 15 minutes before this happened. I told a buddy that it made me a little uncomfortable with all these people walking around with guns in the open trying to sell them. Most had outrageous price tags on them. I understand a vendor selling guns, cause most if not all are secured with a steel cable for theft reasons and they are not loaded. You have NO idea about individuals walking around outside the building with their guns hanging out. I'm all for 2nd Amendment Rights and a gun owner, but some of those nuts just creeped me out.

  • junkmail5 Jan 21, 6:04 p.m.

    And my apologies, the law is even laxer than I suggested...

    it's not that you must reasonably think they CAN buy a gun legally.

    It's just that you can not have a reason to reasonably think they CAN'T.

    To be specific:

    "A person may sell a firearm to an unlicensed resident of his State, if he does not know or have reasonable cause to believe the person is prohibited from receiving or possessing firearms under Federal law"

    And no records are required at all-

    "When a transaction takes place between private (unlicensed) persons who reside in the same State, the Gun Control Act (GCA) does not require any record keeping. A private person may sell a firearm to another private individual in his or her State of residence and, similarly, a private individual may buy a firearm from another private person who resides in the same State."

    So yeah, basically unless they tell you they're not eligible to purchase or otherwise make it obvious in some way, you can legally sell to them.

  • junkmail5 Jan 21, 5:53 p.m.

    "simply unshackling the ATF and letting them actually do their job... "...actually, the ATF has been known to 'troll' gun shows hoping to 'gin up business' by having undercover agents soliciting advice from vendors on how find necessary parts for, or learn how to convert, semi-auto weapons to full automatic, then arresting them...
    Eightball

    Which they should, since that's illegal.

    But they don't do much of that.... because they're so vastly understaffed they only have enough people to visit each FFL once every 20 years (not a typo) to check records, inventory, or anything else.

    Which seems a bit light to me.

  • junkmail5 Jan 21, 5:51 p.m.

    junkmail5, by making one reasonably know a person can own a firearm, would mean you could not sell legal to felon, if you know this to be the case. cegrader

    And you're correct so far... then you make a weird jump in thinking-

    The question is what is reasonably, therefore if if you don't ask your breaking the law -cegrader

    Which is completely untrue.

    You're not REQUIRED to ask. At all. "He looked ok to me" is legal justification for "I had no reason to think he was not legally ok to buy a gun"

    That's why folks want background checks to be required for private sale... because right now you are NOT obligated, as a seller, to CHECK anything at all. Unless he actively gives you a reason to suspect he's not legal to buy you can sell it to him.

  • BigSteamnTurd Jan 21, 5:44 p.m.

    Are they still open? Do I have time to get a few more before O takes them all?

  • cecgrader Jan 21, 5:43 p.m.

    junkmail5, by making one reasonably know a person can own a firearm, would mean you could not sell legal to felon, if you know this to be the case. The question is what is reasonably, therefore if if you don't ask your breaking the law, if the buyer lies he/she is breaking the law. Same applies to any mental conditions.

  • Eightball Jan 21, 5:39 p.m.

    "simply unshackling the ATF and letting them actually do their job... "...actually, the ATF has been known to 'troll' gun shows hoping to 'gin up business' by having undercover agents soliciting advice from vendors on how find necessary parts for, or learn how to convert, semi-auto weapons to full automatic, then arresting them...

  • junkmail5 Jan 21, 5:29 p.m.

    As far as private sells the seller is to make sure the person can legally purchase the firearm -cecgrader

    They aren't actually. They just have to reasonably believe the buyer can legally buy it. They're not required to check, in any way under federal law.

    Requiring them to do so is one of the very few "new gun law" ideas that has been suggested in fact, that actually WOULD improve safety AND wouldn't infringe on any legal rights of responsible owners.

    Much of the rest could be improved by simply unshackling the ATF and letting them actually do their job... right now they are BADLY underfunded and understaffed, so they're incapable of enforcing existing laws and checking up on existing FFLs, let alone enforcing any new ones.

  • junkmail5 Jan 21, 5:26 p.m.

    "Cars Swimming pools Trains Blunt objects Poisoning with household cleaners Alcohol Drugs"

    When they market and design a pool, train, car, bat, and household cleaner to kill people then your point will make sense.

    -Bill Brasky

    They don't market guns to kill people either, so your point is terrible.

    As all of yours have been regarding guns.

    It makes even less sense when you consider that you're sure those guns ARE marketed that way, yet kill LESS people than all those things!

    For pools, most states have laws to put lifeguards in to keep drowning a down to a minimum-Bill Brasky

    Can you show me the law that requires that for private pools? (which is most of them)

    for trains, we have railroad crossing guards to keep accidents to a minimum. For cars we have airbags, licenses, antilock brakes, and seat belts to limit deaths.
    Bill Brasky

    and yet they still all kill many more than AR-15s do. Why not ban THOSE things instead?

    Because you don't care about lives, just hating guns

  • cecgrader Jan 21, 5:21 p.m.

    they are also all registered, all in the equivalent of the National guard and all carefully screened for criminals and nut cases. I have no issues with gun ownership in the US on the same basis :) Grand Union

    The only reason for registering firearm would be so the gov't could confiscate it later. If a person passes a background check that should be sufficient. As far as private sells the seller is to make sure the person can legally purchase the firearm or both are breaking the law. Firearms can be traced by serial number from the manufacturer to a FFL, then to the original buyer and it is wise to have info on a buyer if you private sell. I would rather have a firearm if the need arises, than need one and not have it.

    As far as the incident at the gun so I hope all recover well. I do realize what happen was lacking in some common sense. I also know other accidents concerning different activities that could have deadly results happen every day through the lack of common sense.

  • disgusted2010 Jan 21, 5:07 p.m.

    I have read the posts with great interest. Unfortunately many posters still do not get it.

    Gun control is NOT about guns, its about CONTROL. It's those who are richer, smarter, "better" telling the rest of us how to live our lives.

  • disgusted2010 Jan 21, 5:04 p.m.

    I don't have to explain myself to anyone as this is a free country but for your edification I'm Scots with dual US, UK citizenship. I've lived in both countries for many years.

    Please do not try to force your UK ideas on us.

  • disgusted2010 Jan 21, 5:03 p.m.

    I have no issues with gun ownership in the US on the same basis :)
    Grand Union

    It's so good of you to allow us to live in your world.

  • beef Jan 21, 5:02 p.m.

    "They also aren't machine guns. The automatic feature being removed prior to handing the weapon over to the ex soldier."

    As long as they are in the military, which 100's of thousands of the Swiss are, their guns are FULLY automatic, and from what I saw, they are kept in the home in a hall closet. When they leave, they are gifted by their government with a semi automatic military style assault rifle. And for some odd reason,they are not inclined to mow each other down. I wonder why that is.

  • bombayrunner Jan 21, 4:56 p.m.

    While guns are banned from the fairgrounds during the annual state fair ...

  • Bill Brasky Jan 21, 4:55 p.m.

    "Cars Swimming pools Trains Blunt objects Poisoning with household cleaners Alcohol Drugs"

    When they market and design a pool, train, car, bat, and household cleaner to kill people then your point will make sense.

    For pools, most states have laws to put lifeguards in to keep drowning a down to a minimum, for trains, we have railroad crossing guards to keep accidents to a minimum. For cars we have airbags, licenses, antilock brakes, and seat belts to limit deaths.

  • beef Jan 21, 4:52 p.m.

    "they are also all registered, all in the equivalent of the National guard and all carefully screened for criminals and nut cases. I have no issues with gun ownership in the US on the same basis :)"

    So, as long as we are screened to the same extent as the Swiss are screened, you don't mind if we have machine guns?

  • torchhappysean Jan 21, 4:47 p.m.

    Has anyone actually watched the video clip? Notice the people all RUNNING AWAY? This is typical of the American mentality today.. Run away and let others deal with the problem!!! 50 yrs ago you would have seen the exact opposite. But nowadays we as a society are more worried about looking out for ourselves than each other.... Also did you hear the woman interviewed?? She stated the ONLY reason she was buying a gun was so she could "get one before they were outlawed". When asked WHY she hasn't gotten one before now she states " I'm scared of them".. Really?? THIS is the kind of person that should be required to take a gun safety course before she was EVER issued a permit or was able to otherwise purchase any type of firearm!!!! This also provides further evidence that the root of the problem is not guns but society itself...

  • Bill Brasky Jan 21, 4:39 p.m.

    "they are also all registered, all in the equivalent of the National guard and all carefully screened for criminals and nut cases. I have no issues with gun ownership in the US on the same basis :)"

    They also aren't machine guns. The automatic feature being removed prior to handing the weapon over to the ex soldier.

  • junkmail5 Jan 21, 4:23 p.m.

    really what are the odds of you ever needing an AR-15 to fight of bad guy- Grand Union

    A partial list of things that kill more people in the US per year than "assault weeapons" do:

    Cars
    Swimming pools
    Trains
    Blunt objects
    Poisoning with household cleaners
    Alcohol
    Drugs Fire

    So why don't you favor banning all of those? If not, why?

    two reasons for that....firstly it rarely happens and secondly its impossible to prove that it ever happens because its requires the assumption that the outcome of any encounter would be the death of one party- Grand Union

    When someone shoots another person that is already actively killing people, you CAN be pretty sure. And there's lots of documented cases of that happening.

    Nor is it especially rare... it's LESS rare than people going on mass shootings with AR-15s in fact.

  • Grand Union Jan 21, 4:00 p.m.

    "You mean like Switzerland, where every able bodied male between the ages of 18 and 50 has an ACTUAL MILITARY MACHINE GUN in his closet? IMHO it's a Mozart vs Eminem thing."

    they are also all registered, all in the equivalent of the National guard and all carefully screened for criminals and nut cases. I have no issues with gun ownership in the US on the same basis :)

  • Grand Union Jan 21, 3:58 p.m.

    ". There were numerous incidents involving AK47's and they are still out there. The crooks still have them."

    really, when did a crook last use an AK and what was the result.

    " But...oh yeah...let's get the ban out and keep AR15's out of the hands of legitimate people and allow those AK47's already out there to remain in the hands of felons. Yeah...that makes sense."

    really what are the odds of you ever needing an AR-15 to fight of bad guy with AK?????? are those odds worth one kids life let alone 20???? you guys are nuts. You do know that don't you?

  • Grand Union Jan 21, 3:55 p.m.

    "Myself, I feel safer at the gun show than the state fair."

    LOl a lot more people go to the state fair than to your hobby show
    so it may well be that this one incident makes you statistically more at risk that at the fair.

  • Minarchist Jan 21, 3:54 p.m.

    "Now...for those narrow minded individuals who are zeroing in on AR15 rifles"

    LOL that would be Mitt Romney in Mass. You did read his gun ban law correct? Isnt that the guy you wanted to be President?

  • Grand Union Jan 21, 3:53 p.m.

    ". But yet when guns are used to save lives, we rarely hear anything out of the media about that."

    two reasons for that....firstly it rarely happens and secondly its impossible to prove that it ever happens because its requires the assumption that the outcome of any encounter would be the death of one party.
    The simplest way to know that its not happening much is data that shows that owning a gun makes you 3X more likely to get shot than not owning one.

  • Minarchist Jan 21, 3:51 p.m.

    "the odds of this happening is extremely low."

    Do you know what the odds of dying in a terrorist attack are? Look at the lives and money we spent on that.

  • Grand Union Jan 21, 3:49 p.m.

    ""Grand Union: you don't appear to be from America. Please explain yourself to the forum."

    I don't have to explain myself to anyone as this is a free country but for your edification I'm Scots with dual US, UK citizenship. I've lived in both countries for many years.

  • redapace Jan 21, 3:47 p.m.

    "And why should there be a shooting? To have a qualified person open a weapon and inspect it for ammo? Get real."

    dsalter - if you were to ask the promoters of the Dixie Gun Show, they would tell you that the people they had checking guns in the lobby were "qualified". Now your panacea is to put "qualified" people 15 feet away, "at the door" checking guns? And you don't think the same thing would have happened 15 feet away? Have you ever been to a gun show?

  • GravyPig Jan 21, 3:40 p.m.

    "Grand Union: you don't appear to be from America. Please explain yourself to the forum."

    You are just now getting that? What tipped you off, the uncanny knowledge of GB or the Union Jack in his profile pic? ;)

  • meeper Jan 21, 3:35 p.m.

    I have an idea. Let's drive this story into the ground. The medias doing what it does best. ANY negative story about guns is front page news, over and over again. But yet when guns are used to save lives, we rarely hear anything out of the media about that.

  • rmsmith Jan 21, 3:30 p.m.

    Man is not perfect and accidents do happen.

    The Dixie Gun Show has thousands of people that attend each gun show which is held every 3 months. The gun show has been around for 20 plus years. While it was a accident and thank goodness no one was seriously hurt, the odds of this happening is extremely low.

    I'd expect that a significant number of people are hurt each year at the NC State Fair and quite a few arrests.

    Myself, I feel safer at the gun show than the state fair.

  • dsalter Jan 21, 3:28 p.m.

    NY just passed a law outlawing magazines that hold more than 7 rounds. According to the show I watched, this also includes law enforcement. Brilliant! The reason law enforcement went from .357 revolvers to semi auto 9 mm/40 cal handguns was due to the crooks having the firepower. And they didn't. And another thing....I do not have an "assault" rifle...don't intend to own one, but I do support those who choose to own one of these weapons LEGALLY. It's their right. Now...for those narrow minded individuals who are zeroing in on AR15 rifles...what do you think ever happened to all the illegal AK47 rifles we used to hear about? Most of them fully automatic. There were numerous incidents involving AK47's and they are still out there. The crooks still have them. But...oh yeah...let's get the ban out and keep AR15's out of the hands of legitimate people and allow those AK47's already out there to remain in the hands of felons. Yeah...that makes sense.

  • beef Jan 21, 3:20 p.m.

    "guns are much heavier and cheaper than drugs so much harder to smuggle in bulk. try swallowing a AR-15 and getting on a plane!"

    Yes, look at how difficult it is for the Mexican drug cartels to smuggle weapons back into gun-free Mexico.

    "Then how do the europeans manage to do so just fine?...

    You mean like Switzerland, where every able bodied male between the ages of 18 and 50 has an ACTUAL MILITARY MACHINE GUN in his closet? IMHO it's a Mozart vs Eminem thing.

  • beef Jan 21, 3:00 p.m.

    One interesting aspect of the current push for gun bans is the focus on "assault weapons". Relatively few murders are committed with long guns, but you cannot fight a war with Glocks. It makes me wonder what they are really worried about: murder or insurrection?

  • beef Jan 21, 2:55 p.m.

    The Second Amendment protects the right to keep and bear arms. The Supreme Court, the same one led by the guy who put Obamacare over the top, has affirmed this. If you don't like the Second Amendment, then get off your lazy rears and get it repealed. Quit trying to do ends around around our foundational law.

Oldest First