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dwntwnboy2 Dec 31, 4:42 p.m.
"Well you can't fault liberals about one thing. They're always great about spending other peoples money"- for the record, it's OUR money as well. I don't remember getting a say in the Republicans spending all that tax money on the wars for profit they had in Iraq and Afghanistan. Parks are a much better use of the money - and cost a LOT less. For what we spent in ONE week in Iraq, we could have a dozen of these parks.
Karmageddon Dec 31, 9:58 a.m.
I can't wait to see how much this will add to the property taxes that I already pay to Wake County and the city of Raleigh.....and before it's over there will probably be an additional state tax as well.
SaveEnergyMan Dec 28, 7:46 p.m.
I for one think it is a wonderful use of land. Parks serve the "mental health" of all. Pullen Park is packed most days and this land could be put to good use.
Too many people can't put politics aside (just like our wonderful Congress) and see that this deal serves the people of the local area. I'm not fond of our current governor, but this was a good decision - a decision that was, of course, motivated in part by building a "legacy".
The mentally ill were moved out some time ago and so the state was already in violation of the original bequest. We can let the land sit idle, sell it to developers, or use it as a park. Having Raleigh do it means that they will finance the building of facilities and not the state. Parks are a service to the citizens and not a revenue generator, just like most city services. The city is NOT a business and can't be run as such.
bphelps3 Dec 28, 6:52 p.m.
I have read posts here for ages and decided to register today because of this article and the comments about it.
Many of you obviously have not been to the campus. It is already a park for the most part. I have spent countless weekend there flying RC planes as many other do. I would love to see details for the plans of Destination Park, but the facility is already a wonderful place to jog, picnic, fly RC planes, drive RC cars..... or anything you would typically do at a park, because it's basically a park already.
As for crime in the area, I have not once felt threatened or concerned. The local police have stopped and watched us fly our planes at times and they make very regular passes through the campus.
Not going to debate the political portion of this, but am very happy it is going to remain a park, I just hope it doesn't change much. It's a great place right behind the farmers market. Everyone should go check it out and enjoy it.
meeper Dec 28, 5:15 p.m.
Well you can't fault liberals about one thing. They're always great about spending other peoples money. Let's see how many tax dollars will be blown on this wasteful project. It's always about the children and their future.
abaugh Dec 28, 5:08 p.m.
lewiskr45 Dec 28, 4:58 p.m.
The State did not decide to make this a park by way of kicking out the patients in the hospital. The State did, unfortunately, close down the hospital, and THEN decided on the future of the site. There were 2 options it seemed, a park or development of the site. The last thing this area needed was more parking lots, more poorly designed shopping centers, more cars, etc. Right decision was made.
dwntwnboy2 Dec 28, 3:35 p.m.
"In other words, yet another thing people's tax dollars will be paying for"- it beats the war-for-profits that we "fought" in Iraq doesn't it? For what we paid for one week of Bush's folly in Iraq, we could have paid for this park over and over again. Make parks, not war. :-)
Hans Dec 28, 3:16 p.m.
"It is STILL owned by the state, will bring in money year after year and at the end, is STILL owned by the State." - dwntwnboy2
L to the LOL. In other words, yet another thing people's tax dollars will be paying for.
affirmativediversity Dec 28, 2:50 p.m.
Let them eat cake...oh wait cake has sugar and next to no nutritional value so should therefore not be encouraged...let them eat the park's plants instead... because
Who needs in-hospital mental health services anyway? The Democrats did away with mental health patients.
abaugh Dec 28, 2:18 p.m.
Yea! Just keep Art Pope away from it!
dwntwnboy2 Dec 28, 2:08 p.m.
"The great property give away"- what are you talking about? Nothing was "given" to anyone. It is STILL owned by the state, will bring in money year after year and at the end, is STILL owned by the State. It's a win win.
dwntwnboy2 Dec 28, 2:06 p.m.
"tell us again how liberals care for the needy and downtrodden unless they're in in the way and occupy some land that's in a prime location for surrounding development"- guess you missed the part about the new, state of the art hospital that was built to replace Dix. Did that pass you by? And if it wasn't a park, then it would have been sold to developers anyhow. What's the difference? The hospital was closed long ago, land was sitting there and it was going to be sold or used for something, a park is just as good a use- if not far better than- as a strip mall or office park (of which there are MORE than enough around)
dwntwnboy2 Dec 28, 2:02 p.m.
"everyone will bring their snowflakes to a park that's directly across the road from Central Prison, where they used to do executions and where protesters may often be found"- sure they will. They flock to Pullen Park that is just as far away from the same prison and HAS been for over 100 years. Protesters at the prison? Really? There are 3-5 there every Monday from 5-6pm and that is the extent of prison protests I have seen in the last decade there. Some of us have lived in that area for decades and KNOW what goes on there- not much of anything to worry about really. A park is a great idea and much needed green space should be saved. Hospital was closed LONG before Bev got in office- but only people who have been paying attention know that.
Barfly Dec 28, 1:41 p.m.
There's a reason Dix was closed. Shipping patients 32 miles north, to rural Granville County, got them out of downtown Raleigh.
Dix served a huge population of mentally ill citizens. Raleigh had the best local resources to serve them. Now, they're mostly out of sight out of mind. Butner might as well be on another planet.
BEACH Dec 28, 1:40 p.m.
Real smart a park instead of a place to help the mentally ill. NC needs that place so bad.Great example of our Gov. Bev.
ParadoxInLife Dec 28, 1:10 p.m.
Shouldn't have said 'given' in my statement, since it was purchased...but my point stands.
cushioncritter Dec 28, 1:07 p.m.
The election/inauguration delay (Jan 20 Federal, Jan 5 NC) historically was to allow the elected to arrive in DC/Raleigh by horse. This needs to be changed so that politicians like Bev Perdue are out as soon as their successors can arrive via car/plane with no time to issue pardons and enter into leases.
Hans Dec 28, 1:04 p.m.
Destination park - It'll be more fun than jogging on the Tobacco Trail!
robertleonard01 Dec 28, 1:01 p.m.
The city of Raleigh has the smallest ratio of city park land to city size in the US. More park land is a good thing!! I'm not saying it will be Central Park, but I'm sure people thought a big park in the middle of Manhatten was dumb.
ParadoxInLife Dec 28, 12:47 p.m.
Monkey, the state could have used the land to ADD services for the mentally ill, which is what the land was given to the state to do originally. If you think we don't have people out there that could use the services here in Raleigh, I'd love to enlighten you.
TVs_Deceit Dec 28, 12:36 p.m.
This deal also stinks because the citizens of Raleigh will have to pay over $50 Million to only rent land worth a high-end estimate of $35 Million.
They're saying they couldn't agree on a sell price, so Raleigh will have to rent instead of buy.
But how much you want to bet that the -real- reason for renting is so Raleigh wouldn't have to put the issue up for a bond vote..
..and let the majority of the citizens decide, instead of a few well-connected insiders who are positioned to make a fortune off of the deal.
monkeyboy Dec 28, 12:35 p.m.
sure are a lot of uninformed commenters on here, seemingly believing that north carolina is just kicking the mentally ill into the streets so they can grab the land. so please read:
THE STATE FACILITY OPENED IN BUTNER YEARS AGO! IT'S A STATE-OF-THE-ART HOSPITAL BUILT TO REPLACE OF AN AGING, OUT-OF-DATE ONE! THE PEOPLE WHO USED TO BE TRANSPORTED FROM CHARLOTTE OR GREENSBORO OR WILMINGTON OR ANYWHERE ELSE IN THE STATE TO RALEIGH ARE NOW TRANSPORTED TO BUTNER INSTEAD!! THERE ARE VERY FEW PATIENTS LEFT AT THE DORTHEA DIX FACILITY!!
this is an excellent action by the city and state, and kudos to them for acting on a once-in-forever opportunity like this. for those of you who don't like it, i hear I-95 runs north, too. feel free to use it.
Terkel Dec 28, 12:18 p.m.
YES, everyone will bring their snowflakes to a park that's directly across the road from Central Prison, where they used to do executions and where protesters may often be found.
Can't wait for the first lockdown at this "destination park", and I grieve to see this piece of greenspace thrown to the curs by an angry loser.
TVs_Deceit Dec 28, 12:18 p.m.
pie-twn-boy, tell us again how liberals care for the needy and downtrodden unless they're in in the way and occupy some land that's in a prime location for surrounding development.
Crayzee1 Dec 28, 12:17 p.m.
Well karbattle, if an outside contractor demolishs the building, then yes they should get paid. However if the state is using all state employees and equipment, then no. You don't pay yourself to cook your own meals do you? Do you pay yourself to wash your car? Probable not. So in this case the state is leasing land to the city to use it as a park. The city must pay $50,000,000 dollars to have the rights to make it a park. ON TOP of all the cost associated with running it as a park. but when I say city, I mean taxpayer. As a taxpayer, I would rather the state suck it up, and waive the lease fee of $50,000,000. IN fact they should, if the city of raleigh's citizens want it turned into a park, and are willing to finance it as a park, let us vote it on a bond. BUT again, the state should not charge a lease fee. All that lease fee is, is a way to transfer dollars from the citizens of raleigh to the state coffers. The government never makes good decisions with others money. NEVER.
TVs_Deceit Dec 28, 12:06 p.m.
Given that this land was purchased via a bond referendum for the express purpose of building a hospital on the land, I think it may be illegal to re-purpose the purchase.
In other words, the State of North Carolina put forth a bond in order to accomplish a single purpose, and now the State wants to use the bond proceeds for something completely different.
It's like they implied one contractual reason, and now are violating the contract.
The only legal thing to do would be for the State to sell the land in an attempt to re-acquire the funds spent [adjusted for inflation] and return the funds to the people of The State for other use, and have the City of Raleigh put forth a bond referendum for approval to purchase the land for a park.
What's the point of ever approving another bond if the Government's going to just turn around and spend the money for something else?
That school bond? Yeah, how long's that going to be used for a school before the government uses the money elsewhere?
baldchip Dec 28, 11:58 a.m.
The great property give away. Hope all are happy.
dwntwnboy2 Dec 28, 11:56 a.m.
"The parks we have are hardly used now"- you haven't been by Pullen lately have you? It's over run with people on any day that isn't freezing and raining. To say we don't use the parks is to not pay attention- Raleigh residents use the parks they have in great numbers- they use the greenway trails too.
thayerguy Dec 28, 11:55 a.m.
"Another bad decision by our current governor"
Correction: Another GOOD decision by our current governor.
karbattle1 Dec 28, 11:48 a.m.
Should have sold it to Disney and built a theme park. Or sold it to any corporation that would have developed it.
Raleigh should sell the old police station and build a new one on a vacant lot at Bloodworth and Martin. Why pay demolition fees?
Crayzee1 Dec 28, 11:48 a.m.
It doesn't matter how much the total we pay in tax dollars, at least according to out president, its the percentage of tax dollars that we spend must pay trueblue. I pay just over 40% in taxes, and it disgusts me to the core that the city funnels tax dollars to the state by leasing land. It should be free for the city to use if the state is not going to use it. It's no different then the way the state buys all these cars for every agency, then charges each and every agency a lease fee every single month, whether they use the car or not. It is US the taxpayer paying for the waste. No company would ever do something so grossly inefficent and just plain dumb. However if citizens can not see why this is a wasteful idea, then we will never get away from it.
trueblue0100 Dec 28, 11:31 a.m.
Why does this city keep building parks in areas that are known for crime area. Do you think I will ever go on a walk in that park. It is just another Durham park where you will need a body guard to walk safely. Another waste of my tax money.
I am so sick and tired of hearing about how they spend your tax dollars. I mean, just how much do you pay in taxes? Are you that rich?
It would really help people like you to understand that this property is located in Raleigh and not Durham.
jrfergerson Dec 28, 11:29 a.m.
Another bad decision by our current governor
Wiser_now Dec 28, 11:27 a.m.
I just don't see this becoming the wonderful thing the supports believe it will be. I hope I'm wrong. I still think the area needs more mental health facilities than parks.
ncpilot2 Dec 28, 11:25 a.m.
The government empire building continues at OUR expense.
rlee1117 Dec 28, 11:18 a.m.
After the shootings last week of those poor little kids can we afford to downsize our mental hospitals? What is better to have a park or a safer world for people that really needed this place for help! Have we not learned a thing at all about helping people that has mental problems with no place to go!
ccsmith1902 Dec 28, 11:00 a.m.
This would have been better used as a mental health facility.
Crumps Br0ther Dec 28, 10:54 a.m.
Has anyone figiured out what a "destination park" is yet? Destination for the homeless?
SmokeWagon Dec 28, 10:52 a.m.
..."How does a park pay for itself...packfan1752..."
With YOUR stolen tax cash.....!!!!!!
cjw6105 Dec 28, 10:50 a.m.
First a park, then parking meters.
Bellar1 Dec 28, 10:50 a.m.
Like the deal or hate the deal, but get your facts straight. The "Dix family" did not bequeath this land; they didn't own it. It was part of the Hunter plantation and was purchased with a state appropriation and a bond issue for the purpose of establishing the hospital, named for Dorothea Dix's father, not her at her request.
TVs_Deceit Dec 28, 10:24 a.m.
There's already millions of dollars of development projects contingent on this site being turned from a hospital to a park.
Oh course "banker" likes it, and that developer dude who looks like someone they dug out of the Dix graveyard is all for it too.
And then you see all the hypocritical "we care about the downtrodden" "liberals", who amaze me that they can still say that and look in the mirror at themselves after pushing some of the most helpless among us off their rightful land in favor of big money downtown developers.
All of y'all pat yourself on the back for getting rid of the undesirables that were hindering your dreams of a "big city" park and "big city" downtown development.
You're all nothing but a bunch of hypocrites.
Fun Dec 28, 10:20 a.m.
So the state has taken land "bequested" by the Dix family to serve as a "mental health facility" via fiat- Apparently the legalize doesn't allow a sale so the liberals created a "fiat lease" to repurpose the land-- These folks are morally bankrupt-
Who can name the ring leader?
packfan1752 Dec 28, 10:20 a.m.
"Thank you Gov Perdue for this wonderful gift to the City and citizens of this state. Glad my tax dollars are going to something so great!"
Um, what? It was already owned by the State, they are just leasing the land to Raleigh. It isn't a gift, its another way to get tax money in the State government hands.
Crayzee1 Dec 28, 10:19 a.m.
"it's rightful occupants, the patients Dorothea Dix worked so hard for." because someone has mental health issues, they get to own the land? I get it. I truly do.
packfan1752 Dec 28, 10:18 a.m.
The parks we have are hardly used now. Many of the trails have been taken over by gangs. I see no positives. Certainly will not pay for itself.
packfan1752 Dec 28, 10:17 a.m.
How does a park pay for itself...
Crayzee1 Dec 28, 10:16 a.m.
I am dumbfounded why people do not see this for what it is? Why is raleigh paying the state for the land to lease? Why doesn't the state just turn it into a park and save the taxpayers $500,000 a year? Oh wait, that makes sense? Yet many people will argue and say it's the state's land and the city wants to use it for a park. it, as in the state, is owned by the people. The government exists because we allow it to exist. THEY SHOULD NOT BE LEASING THE LAND FOR MONEY to another municipality. It only decreases economy freedom of the people. It's foolish. I wait for the day my fellow citizens wake up and recongize the fleecing of the citizenship by corrupt government.
pappybigtuna1 Dec 28, 10:08 a.m.
I would like to know "HOW" this will pay for itself? Furthermore. "HOW" will it generate revenue?
Most of you waving your arms in victory, will probably never visit this place.
Do not sign the paperwork until Perdue is out of office, she wants her name on this piece of ground, her legacy. I say let her have her invention of Red Hat and the Interstate to nowhere as her legacy.
Published: 2007-10-05 09:38:00
Updated: 2013-09-05 17:25:12