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pbjbeach Dec 20, 11:02 a.m.
state employee wer however around in 1968 when ii statrted to work with the ncdot.an i am being blacklisted from being allowed to obatin new employment with in any private industry anywhere as that have attempted to be a whislteblower as it relates to false claims issues on a highway contract project. what ever happen to the subshine laws in this state. it is time to let the sunshine in on all of the wronmg doing thatare currently being allowed within state government but most especially so within the ncdot an more especially so within the materials an test unit a that they have allowed for bad non-specefications materials to be utlized within an incoporated into highway construction projects thorughout this state just becasseu some one somewhere is getting some form of campaign contribution form some contracting enity somewhere thank you
pbjbeach Dec 20, 10:49 a.m.
it would definetly appear tome that if a state employee retires an so chose to work somewhere else in the private sector in order to have gainful an meaningful employment to be able to generat additional income that that would be an indivsuals choice an personal freedoms under the u.s constituion. so what buisines is it of a former employer to be allowed have infulence into their personal; lives an decisions after they have retired from state government. as to the indivsual that you have listed below they are fomer politican an th4y are an feel thay are better than the generall public at large an they are entitled to as they so please with any form of regards for the laws,policy's or what everyopu know the upper crust in this state as they view themselve that they make the laws but the are immuned from the laws themselves so they get to do what ever the hell they want to it is only us peion that have to abide by the states laws an not them . they are the chosen ones a
chrisbrown397 Dec 12, 11:06 a.m.
Further research shows four retired State Judges, Justices, Attorney Generals, Governors Legal Counsel now work for large law firms that do a lot of contract work with and even for the State.
Is their state retitrement income being cut? NOPE.
chrisbrown397 Dec 12, 10:36 a.m.
Read the Complaint. The legal issue is what does the law mean. It says benefits can be cut when the retiree goes to work with an "employer that participates in the retirement system." The key word to be defined by the Court is "participates." It is a simple case. A resolution helps not just Mr. Petty but all state employees who began their job and kept their job under a clear employment contract that says they can work after retirement but not with "an employer that participates in the retirement system."
Employee handbooks are not "the law." That is a not an valid or educated remark from Chapel Hill. And the handbooks were not around when the employment contract between Mr. Petty and the State was begun in the mid-1970's. No employer or party to a contract can change a contract without expressly reserving the legal right to do so. It's called "unconstitutional impairment of contract."
Opinions of State Staff lawyers are not "the law." The Legislature enacts "the Law." The Court
pbjbeach Dec 12, 10:35 a.m.
it appears to be no end too the crewing over of state retires an state employee in general just let state employee continue to support these darn repulican party members in this state an they will not have seen anything yet as to what is to come with the current newly elected incomming governor of this state an.i peridict that state employees will continue to get screwed over as long as the repbulcian party controls the governor office an both state houses of government over issues such as denial of promontional oppurnitys raises benefits or whatever that relates to state employee for the repbulcian party are seeking to destroy the woking middle class in this state once an for all an they will continue to give the copoate instrest all of the coporate welfare thatthey can give to them in the form of incentives an give aways to the special instrest groups that suppport the repbulcian instrest an the coporate instrest an the chamber of commerce in this state thank you
pbjbeach Dec 12, 10:22 a.m.
you only get the states matching funds added into your retirement salary after you have officaly submitted yur retirement paper work to the state an teacher retirement system then an only then do you receive the state matching funding dollars as thatthis is part of the originaly promises that were indicated when you first started to work for state government as a contractual agreeement between yourself an state government thatupon retirement thatyou would receive a pension based upon your highest four years of salary over the life time of your employment within state government thank you
davidk_at_unc Dec 12, 10:20 a.m.
Sorry, these did not come out clearly in my last posting.
Teachers and State Employees / Local Governmental Employees / Legislative / Firemen and Rescue Squad Workers / Consolidated Judicial / State Law Enforcement Officers / Local Law Enforcement Officers
pbjbeach Dec 12, 10:13 a.m.
the state of north carolina is out to destory allof their employee work place right just as is taking place with in the state of michigan at this time. they have allowed for contracting enitys in this state to have undue influence as it relates to state employees being allowed to do an carry out their offical jobs dutys an responsiblitys as state in the state own personnel manual there is on going fraud with the ncdot an the allowance of overpayments on contracts for highway construction projects. i paid into the states retirement at a rate of 6.0 % of my salary for a time period of forty years ani nevr got to the top of my salary range either. ther salary ranges have been set up to insure that state employees will never get to the top of the salary range. i feel like that there are quite possibly civil an constitutional right issues thta surround these particular issues of them being able to deny any ones rights to employement from anywhere of their personaly choseing where ever th
davidk_at_unc Dec 12, 9:59 a.m.
"There are different rules for different state jobs... NC State Employees, Teaching Employees, Local Government Employees, etc. The rules you keep posting are for only one of those." -- methinks
Your statement is correct, but only partially, and the part that IS correct is irrelevant to this discussion.
There ARE different rules for different groups within state government. Here is a list of the handbooks for the seven groups:
Teachers and State Employees
Local Governmental Employees
Firemen and Rescue Squad Workers
State Law Enforcement Officers
Local Law Enforcement Officers
Note that teachers and generic state employees are covered by the same policies. The person in question worked for the DOT, putting him in the first category. These ARE the rules I've been presenting and they DO apply to him. If you think anything I've posted is incorrect, please send me a link to support your position. Otherwise, I am done with this discussion!
methinks Dec 11, 6:59 p.m.
There are different rules for different "state" jobs. There are NC State Employees, Teaching Employees, Local Government Employees, etc. The rules you keep posting are for only one of those.
aspenstreet1717 Dec 11, 6:27 p.m.
Simple you can't draw on your pension until you stop working. That's what retirement is.
davidk_at_unc Dec 11, 6:13 p.m.
"my understanding is that you cannot work for a different department with the same state, in any capacity with another state, or perform the same job in the private sector." -- methinks
No, that's not true either. After a period of absence (6 months, I think) you can come back to work part time but there is a limit as to how much you can make and still draw retirement.
Please read starting on page 25 of the NC State Retirement Handbook
People, this is about the 4th or 5th time I've posted this link today. PLEASE GO READ THE HANDBOOK BEFORE YOU MAKE ANYMORE INCORRECT COMMENTS! You're spreading rumors and confusing people unnecessarily!
davidk_at_unc Dec 11, 6:07 p.m.
"The state money paid to him is the matching contribution the state paid into his retirment in his behalf. ... Your state retirment is cut when you continue to work. " -- superman
stooperman, please stop embarrassing yourself! Even I'm starting to feel sorry for you.
methinks Dec 11, 5:02 p.m.
my understanding is that you cannot work for a different department with the same state, in any capacity with another state, or perform the same job in the private sector. If this man is employed as a surveyor by a company that has state contracts, then isn't he really double dipping??
geoherb1 Dec 11, 4:53 p.m.
This man could make an unlimited amount of income from another employer. The rules of the Retirement System, however, limit the amount he is able to earn while working for the state even though it's through a contractor. It's something he should have known.
davidk_at_unc Dec 11, 4:51 p.m.
"davidk - been working for state over 15 yrs - not on my pay stub. However, it does earn interest." -- ashewing
I've been working for the state for 28, and it's always been on mine. Yes, your contributions DO accrue interest, and if you leave your state job and decide to take your money out of the retirement system you get everything you contributed plus the interest earned, but you do NOT get the portion that the state contributed. If you stay in until you retire, your retirement pay is based on a formula that uses your age, the avg of your fours highest years of salary and how long you worked for the state. It not based on the total amount you contributed. Here's a link that explains the difference between a defined benefits plan (state plan) and a defined contribution plan.
Here's the link to the state retirement handbook.
davidk_at_unc Dec 11, 4:40 p.m.
"davidk - you're correct in the 13.12% however that is for benefits ONLY (ie; health insurance). That 13.12 does not have anything to do with our retirement." -- ashewing
Sorry, that's just not right. I don't know how to make this much clearer. Page 6 of the retirement handbook states:
"You, the State, and the investment earnings on total contributions pay the cost of providing your retirement benefits."
Benefits includes your retirement pay.
I don't know which organization you work for, but my pay stub shows the portion my organization pays for benefits that don't come out of my check. These include SS, Medicare, Health Insurance and the "State Retirement Plan". The retirement plan does not pay you based on the total amount you put into the system but rather on a formula that uses your 4 years of highest earnings, how long you worked for the state and your age. Your previous statement that the state doesn't contribute is just plain wrong. Sorry. Go read the manual.
superman Dec 11, 4:34 p.m.
The state money paid to him is the matching contribution the state paid into his retirment in his behalf. He only paid a part of what the state is paying in the form of his retirement. Maybe the State Income Tax Divion caught him when he filed his income taxes. Your state retirment is cut when you continue to work. Would he classify himself as "retired" or "working". On his taxes he would have to list his retirement income in one section and his work income in another section. That would automatically raise a red flag on his income tax form when he submits it.
superman Dec 11, 4:25 p.m.
He didnt retire he just quit and went to work for someone else. Retirement to me means not working. He knew his payment would be reduced if he continued to work and the same is true if he was receiving SS. The employee contributes as well as the state. If you withdrew your retirement as a lump sum you would realize that only your contribution would be refunded. Most teachers are paid by the state. The county or school system actually do the payroll but the check is drawn on the state. He knew the rules but like some politicians he got caught.
jetset Dec 11, 4:06 p.m.
I agree with Gator Girll. Doesn't sound like State dollars are being paid DIRECTLY to him. Also, no state retirement benefits should be taken out either since he is not actually working for the state of NC. He is working for a private company! So, does the State monitor every employee that works for the company they contract with? Just curious.
Bellar1 Dec 11, 3:52 p.m.
What is the retirement age for working for the state?
Determined on age plus number of years of service-- 30 years at any age, 25 years at 60 for full benefits. Reduced benefits for fewer years and/or younger retirement age.
ashewing Dec 11, 3:39 p.m.
@ davidk - yes you're correct in the 13.12% however that is for benefits ONLY (ie; health insurance). That 13.12 does not have anything to do with our retirement. I wish it did however :)
geoherb1 Dec 11, 3:25 p.m.
The State Employee Retirement System's handbook makes it clear that being employed by a contractor doing business with the state makes a retiree subject to the system's rules regarding reemployment. You can't earn more than 50 percent of your gross preretirement income or $30,160 (whichever is greater). The way the earning restriction works is that the month after you exceed the limit, you stop getting retirement pay for the remainder of the year. Your retirement pay starts up again January 1 of the following year--until you exceed the limit again.
NCMom1 Dec 11, 3:19 p.m.
Teachers are covered by the same program as other state employees.
Teachers do pay into the same retirement system, however they are paid by the County and the do have some different guidelines. After a county employee retires, they can come back and work with the county after 6 months... and not affect their benefits...although I am not sure if the hours are limited.
charmcclainlovesdogs2 Dec 11, 3:10 p.m.
What is the retirement age for working for the state?
ashewing Dec 11, 2:39 p.m.
@ davidk - been working for state over 15 yrs - not on my pay stub. However, it does earn interest.
charmcclainlovesdogs2 Dec 11, 2:38 p.m.
AT least he is willing and able and wanting to work. Try giving this same job or the DOT job to a 20 or 20 year old man, they will look at you like you are crazy. Simply put, these younger men do not want to work. And the women out there loves supporting them.
charmcclainlovesdogs2 Dec 11, 2:36 p.m.
What a dirty deal this man has received? But he should have checked all of this out before taking this job. Now the rest of us know what to do. I wish him well in this.
davidk_at_unc Dec 11, 2:27 p.m.
"@ Rat Rod - no, the state does not have any matching or other method of contributing to the state retirement. It's deducted from each pay check. The 6% is 100% the employee's money." --ashewing
ARRRGGGGGG! Don't you people ever get tired of BEING WRONG??? AT least EMBARASSED?????
Page 6, State Retirement Handbook
"The State contribution rate for the 2011-2012 fiscal year is 13.12 percent of all members’ salaries to pay for the benefits for you and other members."
rachel Dec 11, 2:24 p.m.
racing away- its dangerous to try and stay with one employer to get your retirement-like as not, the company will fold, or the bosses will steal the retirement money or they will force you out as you get older-the paternal company who looks after you no longer exists.
rachel Dec 11, 2:23 p.m.
this man is entitled to his retirement money and if he chooses to work-he is entitled to a wage-its not theft-its called working for a living and its nobody's business. The state is one sorry institution if they prefer to steal money from him because he is working for it-what a joke-but lets all give more away to the non working and call it justified.
davidk_at_unc Dec 11, 2:13 p.m.
"DO AWAY WITH STATE PENSION PLAN AND RETIREE HEALTH BENEFITS, THEY ARE ENTTTLEMENTS THAT NEED TO BE REFORMED !!!" -- beckerunc
Why? Because you don't get 'em? State jobs aren't exactly coveted for their high salaries or advancement opportunities, but throwing in a retirement plan makes them a little more attractive. It's the deal that state employees agreed to, so it's the deal they are "entitled" to. If you think it's such a great deal perhaps you should apply for one.
racing away Dec 11, 2:11 p.m.
You know I read the story, and he is getting screwed plain and simple. The man worked his time and has EARNED his retirment. Those that think he is trying to get over may also be the same ones that dont stay at a job long enough to retire, which seems to be a growing trend these days with people going from employer to employer trying to make more money instead of setting up their future. I do applaud them for actually working and not joining those millions that can't seem to find a job and getting paid by the government to not even look. If an individual has met the requirements to retire and they choose to do so, then they should be allowed without penalty, and good on them if they can secure future employment and maybe enjoy a better life in the later years. THEY HAVE EARNED IT!!! Not to mention they are already being penalized like the rest of us that work with taxes! JMO
ashewing Dec 11, 2:09 p.m.
@ Rat Rod - no, the state does not have any matching or other method of contributing to the state retirement. It's deducted from each pay check. The 6% is 100% the employee's money.
davidk_at_unc Dec 11, 2:09 p.m.
" "The state contributes into his retirement" No it doesn't. State Gov't workers are forced to pay 6% of their salary into the state pension." -- chuckbiscuits
Well, actually, yes it does. While it's true that employees pay 6% into the retirement fund, the state pays into it as well. If you don't believe me I'd be happy to show you the lines on my pay stub.
davidk_at_unc Dec 11, 2:06 p.m.
The state contributes into his retirement. He agreed to the terms set forth when he signed up for retirement, so technically he is in violation. Doesn't seem fair but what is these days? All of us are penalized if you work and earn X amount of money while drawing Social Security. That's kind of like a double dipping penality that applies to all of us." -- Rat Rod
You have so many incorrect points here it's hard to know where to start. About the only thing you said that is correct is that the state DOES contribute to the retirement plan, but so does the employee. He DOES agree to abide by the terms or retirement, but these do NOT say ANYTHING about not going back to work. The only restrictions are related to going back to work for an employer that participates in the state retirement plan. This man is NOT in violation of any retirement regulations that I'm aware of.
Bendal1 Dec 11, 1:58 p.m.
I work for DOT, and know dozens of retired DOT employees who now work for consultant firms. With more "forced retirements" looming ahead, I will most certainly be watching this lawsuit to see what happens. I totally agree with those saying it's not double-dipping. That's when a retiree continues getting his retirement income while working for another state agency. No one's ever said "no you can't go work for a private firm" and not get your retirement check.
davidk_at_unc Dec 11, 1:58 p.m.
"delilahk2000, the school system falls under the County so I think they have different guidelines from the state." -- NCMom1
Teachers are covered by the same program as other state employees.
davidk_at_unc Dec 11, 1:53 p.m.
"Maybe WRAL would be good enough to post the brochures and documents that are issued to retirees." -- boolittlek
See page 25.
djbyrdnc Dec 11, 1:38 p.m.
I wonder how much this law suit will cost NC taxpayers? Your tax dollars at work. I sure Boyce will get some more people involved some he can get more money from the state.
superman Dec 11, 1:30 p.m.
Retirment progam benfits are calculated partly on the number of years a person would be receiving benefits. If you start working at 20 years old, retire at 35 with 15 years you could be receiving benefits for well over 40 years. Just how fair do you think that is? No retirment plan could collect enough in a short period of time to fund 40 years of retirement. He knew the deal and ss does the same thing--if you continue to work you cannot draw your full retirement. He just thinks he found a loophole. He better hold on to his job cause no company would ever hire a troublemaker.
davidgnews Dec 11, 1:27 p.m.
Is this any more of a conflict of interest than a rep or senator retiring from the legislature or congress, then becoming a lobbyist?
There's no excuse for either in terms of cronyism.
jimandruby1 Dec 11, 1:07 p.m.
the federal gov dose the same to us retired gov worker 60% of our ss benafit is taken away from us.So if you think ss is what YOU HAVE WORED FOR ALL THEM YEARS WELL THINK AGAIN
beckerunc Dec 11, 1:06 p.m.
State workers pay 6% into the plan, the taxpayers fund the difference. DO AWAY WITH STATE PENSION PLAN AND RETIREE HEALTH BENEFITS, THEY ARE ENTTTLEMENTS THAT NEED TO BE REFORMED !!!
chuckbiscuits Dec 11, 1:02 p.m.
"The state contributes into his retirement"
No it doesn't. State Gov't workers are forced to pay 6% of their salary into the state pension. It is his money. If the state wants to impose after-the-fact rules on the use of a worker's salary they should allow people to opt out of the 6% contribution.
lessismore Dec 11, 12:55 p.m.
To retire is to retire......I suppose the state doesn't want anyone who retires to use a pension to make more money than they we're making. Twisted logic, but I follow the logic. If he didn't want to retire he should have kept working for the DOT.
lessismore Dec 11, 12:51 p.m.
We have women on welfare and drawing it from 3 different states. If NC wants to save money, go after that fraud. Or, go after the illegals that get refunds by claiming 8,9,10 dependents....and most of them are in Mexico.
storchheim Dec 11, 12:28 p.m.
"NC and state workers agree that a person can draw full retirement after working and contributing to the pension fund for 30 years. I don't know why there are any restrictions once the worker has fulfilled his/her end of the bargain."
Because the govt wants to confiscate your retirement money for itself and issue IOUs to be dribbled out as they deem you deserve.
storchheim Dec 11, 12:19 p.m.
"And what crucial knowledge could a DOT worker be possibly hoarding to keep the world from spinning?" clueless
I do have an answer for that, but nah. Tired of hyperbolic baiters.
living the dream Dec 11, 12:12 p.m.
The state contributes into his retirement. He agreed to the terms set forth when he signed up for retirement, so technically he is in violation. Doesn't seem fair but what is these days? All of us are penalized if you work and earn X amount of money while drawing Social Security. That's kind of like a double dipping penality that applies to all of us.
Published: 2008-01-11 14:37:00
Updated: 2010-06-21 13:53:03