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  • SARCASTICLES May 23, 7:27 p.m.

    James O'Keefe is carrying on the tradition of sensationalizing pants-on-fire propaganda as "facts". Too bad he won't get help from Andrew Breitbart, he went to his reward back in March. I hope his vat of boiling Haterade is kept at a constant, cozy temperature of 675F. Yep, 'ol Andy has hacked his last election...;)

  • lovelarvae May 18, 7:56 p.m.

    "Your examples represent an extremely small percentage of the population."

    But not nearly as rare as, and as documented actually far more common than, the alleged fraud you are trying to prevent. That's the point.

  • Ripcord May 18, 7:55 p.m.

    "Any other time you're screaming about any expenditure of tax dollars."

    This is tiny compared to what we spend on other items that are pure garbage.

  • Plenty Coups May 18, 7:48 p.m.

    "If they can't get out to get a free state ID"

    Any other time you're screaming about any expenditure of tax dollars. Now you don't seem to care. A "free state ID" isn't really free. Once again, spend millions to try to solve a non existent problem.

  • geosol May 18, 7:42 p.m.

    WooHoo2You wrote: "So the elderly and poor represent an "an extremely small percent of the population?" Are you kidding me?!?!?! You claim otherwise any other time...." In response to a right winger's post.
    THANK YOU!!!!! THIS is exactly the point.

  • Ripcord May 18, 7:41 p.m.

    So the elderly and poor represent an "an extremely small percent of the population?"

    The elderly and the poor who have absolutely no way whatsoever to travel by car or get out of the house is extremely rare. The vast majority of the elderly and poor are NOT in this situation. Those that are have friends and family. They aren't hermits. And most people who really can't get around that well still have bank accounts... which requires a valid ID.

    So lets use your own rule and just not worry about them. If they can't get out to get a free state ID they probably weren't going to vote anyways.

  • WooHoo2You May 18, 7:25 p.m.

    "If you are elderly or very poor, will you bother to do this? When will they get their picture taken? How will someone without a car get there?"

    Your examples represent an extremely small percentage of the population. Further, and these very problems have already been solved in other states. We can do the same. But, using your own logic, since the problem is so small (like voter fraud), why should we address it? Pass the voter ID law and lets not worry about these rare cases.-ripcord

    So the elderly and poor represent an "an extremely small percent of the population?" Are you kidding me?!?!?! You claim otherwise any other time....

  • Ripcord May 18, 7:02 p.m.

    "If you are elderly or very poor, will you bother to do this? When will they get their picture taken? How will someone without a car get there?"

    Your examples represent an extremely small percentage of the population. Further, and these very problems have already been solved in other states. We can do the same. But, using your own logic, since the problem is so small (like voter fraud), why should we address it? Pass the voter ID law and lets not worry about these rare cases.

  • Plenty Coups May 18, 6:37 p.m.

    Plenty-"and subsequently disenfranchising thousands of people"

    Ripcord-"How does that happen? How does that work?"

    You are simply creating another hurdle. Many people already don't bother to vote. If the state does pay for the ID's, will they mail them or will voters have to go pick them up at the DMV? If you are elderly or very poor, will you bother to do this? When will they get their picture taken? How will someone without a car get there? As I already linked to earlier, people are being turned away who have always voted in states that require photo IDs simply because they were unaware of the new law or misunderstood what proof of residency was required in order to get an ID, or because they needed more documentation etc. Some people wouldn't bother.

  • Plenty Coups May 18, 6:28 p.m.

    djofraleigh-Does anyone doubt that JFK had fraud out of Chicago and Mayor Daly helping him win over Nixon in 1960?"

    Fraud? Yes. But investigations show that it probably didn't make a difference. There was much greater effect on voting in the south with literacy tests and poll taxes suppressing the vote.

    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/history_lesson/2000/10/was_nixon_robbed.2.html

    http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2010-09-26-jfk-chicago-politics_N.htm

  • Ripcord May 18, 6:25 p.m.

    "and subsequently disenfranchising thousands of people"

    How does that happen? How does that work?

  • Plenty Coups May 18, 6:14 p.m.

    "Why does voter fraud have to be "widespread" before you'd do anything about it?"

    As I already posted more than once, spending millions of dollars we supposedly don't have and subsequently disenfranchising thousands of people in order to stop two people from voting illegally (in all likelihood a simple case of voting in the wrong precinct by accident)makes little sense.

  • Plenty Coups May 18, 6:03 p.m.

    ABO-"You said millions."

    No, actually I didn't.But the point remains the same. A "million" voters (registered voters, not kids) is an awful lot.

  • djofraleigh May 18, 5:59 p.m.

    How dare they want my ID when I fly or buy a gun!

  • SENCLand Son May 18, 5:54 p.m.

    An analysis by the State Board of Elections obtained Friday by WRAL News shows that at least 700,000 registered voters in the state don't have a driver's license or photo ID issued by the Division of Motor Vehicles. Records for another 300,000 people need further checking to determine if they have a license, elections officials said.

    Anyone know how I can obtain this report? WRAL & the state BOE websites don't seem to help-

  • djofraleigh May 18, 5:52 p.m.

    There's a reason people are against having fingerprints, facial ID, or other proof of ID before voting, and it isn't to protect the wino or mentally infirm not to vote.

    One reason is the silly us vs. them mentality of taking sides and entrenchment.

    Another is that there just might be fraud. Does anyone doubt that JFK had fraud out of Chicago and Mayor Daly helping him win over Nixon in 1960?

  • Ripcord May 18, 5:13 p.m.

    "If I saw evidence of genuine, widespread fraud from either side that would justify the cost, I too would be in favor of ID's."

    Why does voter fraud have to be "widespread" before you'd do anything about it?

  • WooHoo2You May 18, 4:53 p.m.

    SENCLand Son..."Tell me who was responsible for making IDs in 1788, and then I'll show you where in the Constitution that requirement is, okay??"

    Voter Picture ID's did not exist in 1788, nice try though and you still can not show me where in the US Constitution that mandates US Citizens to show a valid ID to cast a vote.-Gidder Dun

    They must have had a lot of painters back in 1788 to supply everyone with 'picture' IDs!!! (the camera was not invented for another 50 years or so)

  • WooHoo2You May 18, 4:51 p.m.

    ??? Gidder Dun, you just answered your own question, then asked it again? Don't know why you threw in picture in the middle of voter IDs- like that matters. But there's no mention of stoplights either, so feel free to ignore them-

    But what in the name of Pete has the US Constitution got to do with voter IDs???-SENCLand Son

    The US Constitution does not allow for a “poll tax” (charging people a tax to vote) therefor unless the government supplies ID’s free and easily accessible to every voter it would be in direct violation of the US Constitution being they would effectively be charged a fee for the ability to vote….get it?

  • WooHoo2You May 18, 4:35 p.m.

    If you were born in the US you should provide valid ID and be allowed to vote here in North Carolina. If you were born in Kenya and got elected illegally you should be impeached and deported.-nobama

    Let’s try this anti-birther argument (this always gets them to change the subject!): Obama’s mother was an American, correct? Anyone born to an American is automatically an American, correct? So being Obama was born to an American he is an American even if it was on the planet Mars, correct?

    Does your head hurt now?

  • SENCLand Son May 18, 4:33 p.m.

    ??? Gidder Dun, you just answered your own question, then asked it again? Don't know why you threw in picture in the middle of voter IDs- like that matters. But there's no mention of stoplights either, so feel free to ignore them-

    But what in the name of Pete has the US Constitution got to do with voter IDs???

  • nobama May 18, 4:24 p.m.

    If you were born in the US you should provide valid ID and be allowed to vote here in North Carolina. If you were born in Kenya and got elected illegally you should be impeached and deported.

  • Gidder Dun May 18, 4:12 p.m.

    SENCLand Son..."Tell me who was responsible for making IDs in 1788, and then I'll show you where in the Constitution that requirement is, okay??"

    Voter Picture ID's did not exist in 1788, nice try though and you still can not show me where in the US Constitution that mandates US Citizens to show a valid ID to cast a vote.

  • working for deadbeats May 18, 4:04 p.m.

    You said millions. I guess you could get to a million if you count kids, illegals and tourists with ID's from other states.

  • WooHoo2You May 18, 3:57 p.m.

    Liberals dismiss voter fraud as a problem because they need it to win elections.-Ripcord

    Liberals dismiss voter fraud as a problem because conservatives have yet to show it is one. Do we need to give you a nightlight to protect you from the monsters under your bed too?

  • Plenty Coups May 18, 3:27 p.m.

    "Millions of people in NC don't have a state issued ID? I'd like to know your source for that gem."

    I don't know about millions, but WRAL reported on a "million" people a while back.

    http://www.wral.com/news/local/politics/story/9059843/

  • Plenty Coups May 18, 3:25 p.m.

    "and it was suspected that voter fraud was being committed"

    If I saw evidence of genuine, widespread fraud from either side that would justify the cost, I too would be in favor of ID's.

  • SENCLand Son May 18, 3:24 p.m.

    'Do you realize that millions of people in this state do not have government photo id's? ...they also don't have cars, phones & may not have a steady roof over their head.

    Since there's almost zero voter fraud that Government-Issued ID's would prevent, it's like you're just trying to limit legal voting. You wouldn't want that, right? (cough)'

    I know these people-they call them children. But all too soon they grow up and get their license to drive, and soon after they become old enough to legally vote!

  • working for deadbeats May 18, 3:20 p.m.

    Millions of people in NC don't have a state issued ID? I'd like to know your source for that gem.

  • Ripcord May 18, 3:19 p.m.

    Liberals dismiss voter fraud as a problem because they need it to win elections.

  • Plenty Coups May 18, 3:14 p.m.

    "How would getting a voter ID deny anybody from voting?"

    A picture ID that costs money would potentially prevent thousands of people (like the poor and elderly) who don't have them from voting. It amounts to a "poll tax" and would therefore be unconstitutional unless the state fully funds them. This then brings us back why is it such a pressing problem if we have no evidence of the need for them? Why do we want to put more barriers in the way of voters?

    http://timesfreepress.com/news/2011/oct/05/marriage-certificate-required-bureaucrat-tells/

    http://www.alternet.org/newsandviews/article/876604/87-year-old_woman_turned_away_from_wi_polling_booth_despite_courts%27_decision_to_suspend_voter_id/

  • sillywabbitthepatriot May 18, 3:07 p.m.

    If the next few years trended towards far right leaning politicians taking seats in state and federal levels including the president and it was suspected that voter fraud was being committed in order to win these seats, these same groups who are against voter ID laws would be adamant about passing the legislation.

  • JustOneGodLessThanU May 18, 2:59 p.m.

    @Comfortably Numb, why do you want to increase government's reach again?

    Last week you used big government to take the freedom & liberty of tax-paying, consenting adult citizens...this week you want to force a tax on people in order to exercise their Constitutional rights.

    Do you realize that millions of people in this state do not have government photo id's? ...they also don't have cars, phones & may not have a steady roof over their head.

    Since there's almost zero voter fraud that Government-Issued ID's would prevent, it's like you're just trying to limit legal voting. You wouldn't want that, right? (cough)

  • working for deadbeats May 18, 2:59 p.m.

    How would getting a voter ID deny anybody from voting? I bet nobody can answer that one without name calling or changing the topic.

  • lovelarvae May 18, 2:43 p.m.

    "You seem to have no problem with spending millions to stop a few people from voting illegally even if it means denying thousands their right guaranteed by the constitution."

    It truly is a case of the cure being worse than the disease.

  • Plenty Coups May 18, 2:25 p.m.

    SENCL-"One does not have to wait until there is a bad wreck with deaths in a busy intersection to know there is a need for a signal."

    A better analogy would be to substitute the busy intersection with a rural intersection, one with little traffic. Then add not only stoplights but a traffic cop and red light cameras.We don't do it because it's not cost effective. You seem to have no problem with spending millions to stop a few people from voting illegally even if it means denying thousands their right guaranteed by the constitution.

  • Plenty Coups May 18, 2:20 p.m.

    SENCL-"They admit that voter fraud is real. Maybe you'll accept their word?"

    Voter fraud is real, but based on any study, and the Board of Elections, the tiny amount that happens each year is 99.9% the result of voter error, like voting in the wrong precinct.

    "BTW what do you mean by widespread- from the ocean to the mountains? Or that it fits your opinion of 'a lot'?"

    When it basically amounts to two or three people a year,and those who do it do it by accident, I'd say it isn't widespread. Widespread would be thousands of people, enough to influence elections. Then it would be a pressing issue.

  • Comfortably Numb May 18, 2:08 p.m.

    WHAT IN THE NAME OF REASONING IS WRONG WITH US HAVING TO SHOW AN ID TO VOTE? We do it for everything else.

  • working for deadbeats May 18, 1:38 p.m.

    I tried showing my ID last week and the registration guy flinched and looked away. He said I can't even look at it. I guess I was being a bigot to myself when I tried showing my drivers license.

  • delilahk2000 May 18, 1:23 p.m.

    IT SHOULD NOT BE HARD TO DO, THEY JUST DO NOT WANT TO DO ANYTHING TO LOSE THE VOTES.......I DO NOT MIND SHOWING MY ID OR BIRTH CIRTIFICATE......

  • SENCLand Son May 18, 1:19 p.m.

    SENCLand son..."Folks, at least try to sound thoughtful-"

    How about reading some of your posts if you want to be thoughtful. Mine is in general and you will not be able to show me where in the US Constitution that requires a VALID ID to vote...
    Gidder Dun
    May 18, 2012 12:56 p.m.

    Tell me who was responsible for making IDs in 1788, and then I'll show you where in the Constitution that requirement is, okay??

  • working for deadbeats May 18, 1:18 p.m.

    I'm unafilliated too, but I am also a conservative and I'll admit it. I know where I stand. Do you?

  • Gidder Dun May 18, 1:05 p.m.

    "One does not have to wait until there is a bad wreck with deaths in a busy intersection to know there is a need for a signal."

    Actually SENCLand Son you are incorrect. Maybe you need to look at many other cities in this great state that have had many deaths at many busy intersections that do not have signals. It takes a few bad wrecks for DOT to respond, but then again I can be wrong but do recall seeing them on the news.

  • davidgnews May 18, 12:57 p.m.

    "Again, if you are against voter ID's than you are for voting fraud."

    Not at all, but this concept was largely cooked up by some fanatics based on their own bigoted opinions. Plain and simple.

    First time voters always have to provide ID, but you never mention that either.

  • Gidder Dun May 18, 12:56 p.m.

    SENCLand son..."Folks, at least try to sound thoughtful-"

    How about reading some of your posts if you want to be thoughtful. Mine is in general and you will not be able to show me where in the US Constitution that requires a VALID ID to vote...

  • SENCLand Son May 18, 12:55 p.m.

    Show me evidence of widespread voter fraud in NC then. Still waiting... -Plenty Coups May 18, 2012 12:16 p.m

    One does not have to wait until there is a bad wreck with deaths in a busy intersection to know there is a need for a signal. But since you really want to know- it's easy. You're at WRAL's website already- look at the video presser that State Representatives Hall, Martin, Brisson, etc. did in February. They admit that voter fraud is real. Maybe you'll accept their word?

    BTW what do you mean by widespread- from the ocean to the mountains? Or that it fits your opinion of 'a lot'? 'Cause you sound, at least to me like one of those who say: 'Just one _____ is too many, we must have ZERO tolerance for ____!'

  • Gidder Dun May 18, 12:52 p.m.

    ABO 2012..."Oh now the left wants to refer to the constitution. How convenient."

    I never said I was on the left or right. Actually I am unaffiliated with any political party. Unlike you it makes you feel good to be associated with one or the other. It is ok but I have yet to see in the US Constitution that it requires a valid ID to cast a vote. Now that being said I ALWAYS show my ID when I vote and make sure they look at it before I am given my ballot to vote. I also NEVER vote straight party, but I bet you do. So sit back and learn something for a change and not the change that was promised 4 years ago. :o)

  • lovelarvae May 18, 12:50 p.m.

    "Again, if you are against voter ID's than you are for voting fraud."

    Again, your statement is totally absurd.

  • working for deadbeats May 18, 12:49 p.m.

    Liberals are just worried that it will be much harder to cheat. Remember the people who were arrested in Wake Co for voting more than once for Obama? Ya....you must have forgotten about that little tid bit.

  • working for deadbeats May 18, 12:47 p.m.

    I haven't see you scare anybody off, bigal. In fact, I haven't seen a sound argument from you yet.

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