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true blue in wake county's blog


speed trapping and radar

Published Feb. 5, 2009
Views: 5593

A favorite of law enforcement officers all over the state, and a not so favorite for the ones who get caught:

"I didn't realize I was driving that fast sir."

"What? No way, your radar is wrong"

"Deputy, I really had to pee...did you expect me to wet my pants?"

"I'm on my way to the hospital, its an emergency"

"Trooper, may I see the radar please"

"What about the guy in front of me that was doing at least 80, but you stopped me instead"

 "Ummm revoke my license on the spot? You can't do that" (yes we can)

We hear it all.  Some politely accept the fact that speed kills and they were indeed exceeding the limit. Works for me - here's your WARNING ticket, now slow down please.  Others - are content to argue and argue and argue and in some cases - argue themselves out of the ticket and into a nice pair of trinkets. Not something I was expecting to accomplish but hey, whose counting.

Are speed traps legal in the state? yup....can we run radar from a residential driveway in a neighborhood that we recieve a wide level of speeding complaints? Sure can....Do we actually even NEED radar to stop a person for speeding and issue either a verbal warning or a state citation? Nope. Wanna know a really sneaky trick we bad cops play? Here's a freebie - I'll back my car between the vehicles on display at car dealerships and run radar....you never even see me.  I'm dastardly like that. 

Although I myself prefer radar, I don't necessarily need it, per supreme court rulings. yes, I know - radar is not infallible, its only as accurate as the user, the cop will lie and use the radar as an "excuse" blah blah blah.  Heres the facts folks:

     No, we cannot "tamper" with the radar in order to raise the speed that you were going just so we can write specifically "you" a ticket.

     Yes, the radar does have its "moments" as far as accuracy - if in doubt, I don't stop the car.  25% of all radar tickets are in error. The most noticeable and common mistakes include shadowing, RFI interference, cosine error and mechanical interference. We as officers all understand this.

     Under NC training standards, officers are not simply handed a Crown Vic equipped with Eagle 2's and told to go forth and multiply. We attend a pretty comprehensive 40hr course with strict training standards that employs use of radar and estimation within 4 mph without radar.

Now, I'm going to really burst your bubble.  You know those really expensive Cobra's and K band radar detectors (among others) that you spend all that money on so you can speed on our freeways?  they dont work!! But *sigh* it does give you that sense of "security" huh....

Passive jammers and active jammers are designed on the theory that when an officer shoots your car with either a radar signal or laser the signal the radar/laser is reflected back to the officers device, with an added FM chirp.

The problem with this theory, if you are further away then three feet from the  radar signal, the reflected signal from your expensive detector is not strong enough to jam. There's more but I won't reveal it all here.

In short - with what I have in my unit - when your chirp goes off, I've already got you. Aint it great!!! My system uses your jam as a reflect and sends the signal back you - after I have acheived a "lock".  Theoritically, I use your own detection signal against you.

My advice? Just slow down...whats the hurry? The movie is not going anywhere, the sale will advertise again, its better to get poked in the eye for being late for work instead of never arriving again.

Enforcement of NC statute 20-16.1 is mainly what I try to focus on. That is the mandatory suspension of driver's license upon conviction of excessive speeding, exceeding by more than 15 miles per hour the speed limit, either within or outside the corporate limits of a municipality, if you were also driving at a speed in excess of 55 miles per hour at the time of the offense, or driving at a speed in excess of 80 miles per hour at the time of the offense. These are the so-called "real money" tickets.  Speeds that no doubt can get you or others around you killed quick. 

Do I care if the speed limit is 55 and you are doing 60? no, get real....I'm more interested in the speed demons and lead foots that are legitimately hauling azz. 

When you get up in the mornings and running a little late, gotta stop by daycare before the late fee kicks in - if you see the lone patrol cruiser sitting at the crest of the hill in the center of the grass - slow down because you never know....

Had a bad experience with a cop running radar and there is just NO WAY (in your mind) you were doing what he/she said you were - post it......

TRU

Filed under: Crime




215 Comments


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Quite disturbing first you make comments about excuses as shown above and then you admit 1-4 reading are inaccurate. Now that is pretty scary.

I guess you missed the next sentence, which you even took the liberty of pasting in its entirety that said ummmm if in doubt - I dont stop. The previous was an example of what we sometimes hear from motorist, among other "nice" things that they say

GGT - its cool dude, but man, that hatred!! You're gonna blow an artery one day with a police bumper stuck to your rear-end with some cop wondering *why is he flopping around like a fish in the front seat............oh well..........dispatch, H-Henry verbal, 10-8

How about this one tru- I have the right to ask when your radar was last calibrated and to please do so in front of me with the tuning fork. If you refuse and we go to court (me with my lawyer) and this is stated- the ticket is null and void?

My brother (a ex highschool jock) is a State Trooper in Fla and this is the law down there. if the motorist asks- you must show them.

GGT - its cool dude, but man, that hatred!

Lets just say I know something that makes me this way.

True Blue Next time you pull one over, just remind them that “it’s the road way not the runway!!”

GGT - not in this state. Its the officer's discretion if he wants to show it to you or not. The courts are not concerend if the citizen viewed the radar and was satisfied - the burden of proof is on the citizen and not the officer. All the state requires is that the officer is certified to operate the equipment and can show IN COURT that the equipment was operational in accordance with statute. This is why I bring my radar log to court with me, my certification, and my verification of my additional 40 hrs of training by another certified operator (stationary/moving front and rear of course). But no, we are not required to show them anything.

I have been surprised by how fast I was going a time or two. If so, I will not fuss. I don't wear short skirts (don't cross dress) or carry donuts so there is no other reason to stop me. I can accept when I have broken the law. I have probably been stopped less than 10 times in my entire life.

Therefore, "I" have no issues and have actually been helped out recently when the state trooper could have made it difficult.

This does not stop me from thinking that given the LEAST provocation my face would be pressed to the blacktop and my person jammed in the back of a crusier because you have nothing better to do.

True Blue, I did not ignor the statement where you stated if "You" were in doubt you don't stop. I do not take things that personal. You offered the statistic and you are only one of how me LEOs that use the radar gun. Thats why I find it scary. If one person gets a ticket and says the radar must have been wrong and they have to pay court cost, attorneys fees or have their insurance go up thats bad right?

I read in the thread thats up to the courts to determine innocense or guilt but there is a real co$t to that which seems ignored here.

what's the fastest that you have ever clocked someone (radar, pacing, etc)? (i know some radars won't go past 100, does yours?)

"How about this one tru- I have the right to ask when your radar was last calibrated and to please do so in front of me with the tuning fork. If you refuse and we go to court (me with my lawyer) and this is stated- the ticket is null and void?"--

Actually, you don't have the right to see the radar at all and have the officer check the unit for accuracy in front of you. If the officer doesn't want you getting out of the car for safety reasons, then the only thing you can do is make your argument in court.

"Leo-nc I pray you pull me next.. lets see if your charge would hold up in court. You wanna fly up on people at high rates of speed, then you get to deal with having to stop or eat my hide. (I hope the latter so I could sue you!)"---

All I have to do is show the video of you driving C&R and slamming on your brakes instead of pulling over as you should. It would be pretty much open and shut. But you see, I know there are people out there like you so I take precautions to protect myself from the drivers I stop. There is a reason they're getting stopped, and it's not because they are the safe driver on the road that day.

"what's the fastest that you have ever clocked someone (radar, pacing, etc)? (i know some radars won't go past 100, does yours?)"--

If he's using a Golden Eagle or Eagle II, it goes much higher than 100.

"If he's using a Golden Eagle or Eagle II, it goes much higher than 100."

i knew some did, but i know of at least one wake county sheriff that has a radar that stops at 100...he gets two solid lines....shooooweee! he was pretty cool though, he was about a mile behind me and had no chance in hades of catching me, but i stopped and waited for him. i wanted to know how fast he clocked me, but he wanted to know how fast i was really going. we both laughed at each other. he put 78 in place on the ticket and in excess of 100 in another spot, and my lawyer was able to get it dismissed somehow based on the two different speeds that the officer wrote.

will either the golden eagle or eagle II measure speeds close to, or in excess of, 200?

also, out of curiousity, what IS the fastest you have ever clocked someone?

For me a motorcycle at 140+ on the interstate. Medium traffic. Took a while to get him but radios work wonders.

radios are hard to beat. that's for sure.

Fastest car 135mph. I'm sure there are guys who've clocked much higher.

passed a trooper once..he was on the side of the road standing beside his car clocking people...passed him at a little over 180, hit about 205 right after. i don't think he moved.

(don't worry, i don't ride like that anymore)

i was just curious to know if he could have actually clocked me at that speed...

Fastest I ever clocked someone was 110 mph - it was another police officer in an unmarked hahahahaha. Thought my glass was gonna bust from the tone...soon as I hit the lights, he hit his...I shut em off and kept going and "alley lighted" him on the way by.

" it was another police officer in an unmarked "

lol...that's pretty good.

rick, what kind of bike were you on?

You know whats really great about that - I charge you with C & R, you beg and snivel in front of the judge with your "I was just trying to slow down and he scared me" routine, who of course reviews the stop from the on-board cam, he finds you guilty with no PJC and you eat both the ticket, the insurance hike or drop you based on the report that I will fax to them and guess who pays for the damage ocurred to your vehicle *ta-da* you!!! if it sounds like we as LEO's are familiar with this tactic - maybe its because we are and so are judges and certainly the insurance companies - you get an F plus for effort though.- Tru Blue

Exactly - you charge you don't make the judge's decision. The judge will review the case and decide based on HIS knowledge of the law. It's funny to read arrogant barely high school educated people like you act like the judge is going to side with you ALL the time. You should give up police work and go into fortune telling!! Need a chest to pin that badge on?

t-man - for the 180-205 i was on a hyabusa.

...not a big fan of the bike, but it's definitely fast. i am a kawi rider (note the profile pic), i was riding a friend's bike that day.

Ok this has always been a subject I've wondered about. What I am understanding from this blogpost is that law enforcement officers intentionally charge people who argue with the police officer with additional offences, while often letting people who don't argue go with no charges at all. Am I understanding that correctly? And if so, is there a stated department policy that directs you to do this, or not to do this. Or is the department silent on the subject?

My chest holds more medals than you can count *smile* ohhh which chest were you refering to??? the police one or the military one that said 3 up, 3 down diamond in the center....just curious

law enforcement officers intentionally charge people who argue with the police officer with additional offences, while often letting people who don't argue go with no charges at all. Am I understanding that correctly? And if so, is there a stated department policy that directs you to do this, or not to do this. Or is the department silent on the subject?

ummm yeah, the policy is called "officer discretion" Or would you prefer an arrest for disorderly conduct - which by statute is one that I and not the offender will define. Not everybody I stop has just absolutely gotta get a ticket, however, there are those that definately earn them.

So I guess it's the disorderly conduct part that has me. So if the person argues "you are crazy there's no way I was speeding"... you can call that disorderly conduct and arrest them?

point is, you're never, ever going to get anywhere by arguing with a cop on the side of the road. im no cop, but i have received more tickets than probably everyone you know added up. from experience, i can tell you that your best bet is to be nice to the cop, and even joke around with him if you can. a laughing cop is a lenient cop. if you're going to fight the ticket, fight it in court, not on the side of the highway.

" i have received more tickets than probably everyone you know added up."

by this, im talking about in excess of 30. well in excess of 30. i had 11 in a year and a half time frame one time. none of these numbers include the countless tickets that i have avoided by being cool to the cop.

Yea i can agree with that. People who are obnoxious to me aren't getting my help. I'm just wondering legally how much discretion a police officer has to just arrest somebody.

ahh...can't help ya there motormonkey. i do everything i can to avoid the bracelets.

Yea I've been arrested three time, to this day I don't know why. All I did was run.

"All I did was run."

from the police? im pretty certain that's an arrestable offense.

you are crazy there's no way I was speeding"...

No I call then expected venting of anger - no problem, they can vent all they want. Its when the F-bombs start dropping, the screaming and profanity starts is when I start changing my mode. I will tell them one time - do not curse at me. One time is all they get. The second I get "Its a free country, I know my rights I can say what ever the "F" I want...out the car they come, into a pair of bracelets and away we go. They can yell lawyer, lawsuit, johhny cochring from the backseat all they want. Never does them anygood.

Well on the one hand, if someone came to my job and started yelling F-bombs at me, I could understand. I would not help them with what they wanted. But to actually know a government employee has the discretion to take somebody's freedom because they dropped the F-bomb, at first glance I find it difficult to agree with that. It sounds like you're saying that like it or not, that's the way it is.

True Blue I have seen those You Tube videos where the operators go off the hook and the police officers are just about to crack up. I appreciate what you guys do out there and the dangers you face on a daily basis.

Tru- Old saying goes...."You can beat the motor, but not the Motorola".....I've always loved that one!

But to actually know a government employee has the discretion to take somebody's freedom because they dropped the F-bomb..

You just said the key words - take somebody's freedom....yes we have the power as police officers to suspend a persons constitutional rights. Pretty powerful tool when wielded properly which most of us in uniform understand perfectly how to wield it. As hard as it is for some to understand something as simple as dropping the "f" word on me - yes - can get your rights intruded upon. Under 4th amendment its called an arrest.

Good food for thought, thx.

ok next question- why would you arrest someone for breaking the law when you are doing the same? This has nothing to do with speeding or that junk-- just in general.. ie: drinking a few beers driving home- I do the same, I'm in the slammer.

ok next question- why would you arrest someone for breaking the law when you are doing the same?

Define please......not sure I understand. I've arrested other police officers for DWI, drugs (yes, drugs) and DV...we get locked up all the time dude....

Tru- that's hard to believe. I thought you guys took care of your own..

Tru- that's hard to believe. I thought you guys took care of your own....

We try real hard but when they cross the line and make a decision that could get me or others killed or hurt seriously, they stopped being "one of my own."

True blue- Your writing labels you as a fairly new LEO. I know because I served 20 years on the same dept. as you. A seasoned officer wouldn't be blogging about the in's and out's of day-to-day law enforcement and how we're "gonna get ya!!!" I was certified by the state in radar operations, stationary, moving and reverse. And yes Joe Public the officer CAN manipulate the radar reading and Blue, if you don't know how to do it, I'm not telling, although I'm sure you do. The problem with most of you gung ho LEO's you enforce the letter of the law instead of the "spirit" of the law. It's something an LEO will learn over the years. For instance- the paper delivery man rolls through a stop sign at 4:00 am with not a car on the road. Johnny gung ho is all over him and writes him. Officer Seasoned may stop the car just to make sure the driver is not impaired, but after investigation lets them go with a "have a good morning, be careful" My advise- chill. Do your job. Be compassionate!

Fairly new? probably....write the paperboy at 4 am for blowing a stop sign? I got better things to stop cars at 4 am for instead of the guy making a living - compassionate? absolutely. My reason for joining the LEO community - to help others and make a difference no matter how small. You see, I served in a different uniform for 20 consecutive years that taught me a different attribute - Gung Ho was not it, honor was.....must have me confused with the few and the proud.

My chest holds more medals than you can count *smile* ohhh which chest were you refering to??? the police one or the military one that said 3 up, 3 down diamond in the center....just curious

either one is just a failed attempt to inflate a frail ego. I don't care if you wear a crown of thorns on your head and have nail holes in your hands AND feet (grin), respect is earned not granted because you have a badge and a bigger keyboard than anything else.

The second I get "Its a free country, I know my rights I can say what ever the "F" I want...out the car they come, into a pair of bracelets and away we go. They can yell lawyer, lawsuit, johhny cochring from the backseat all they want. Never does them anygood.

Of course it doesn't - you're filing a bogus charge to get your kicks and you know it. No DA in their right mind is going to charge and you're simply inflating that frail ego again. Officers routinely "articulate" (lie) on reports to make circumstances fit the description of certain laws to make it appear as though citizens have broken them.

here's the REAL statute for disorderly conduct - http://www.ncleg.net/enactedlegislation/statutes/html/bysection/chapter_14/gs_14-288.4.html

Using the F word to an officer like Tru merely hurts his ego, it doesn't break any laws of any shape or form. He then simply lies on his reports and "articulates" a situation. Officer accountability is few and far between these days.

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