GOLO: Go Local. Talk Local. Share Local.
oldschool: blog ↓

oldschool's blog


cavemen discovered living in squalor in s. america - compassionate liberals want to leave them that way

Published May 31, 2008
Views: 252

One of South America's few remaining uncontacted indigenous tribes has been spotted and photographed on the border between Brazil and Peru. The Brazilian government says it took the images to prove the tribe exists and help protect its land. Stephen Corry, the director of the group - which supports tribal people around the world - said such tribes would "soon be made extinct" if their land was not protected.  "This is very important because there are some who doubt their existence."

He described the threats to such tribes and their land as "a monumental crime against the natural world" and "further testimony to the complete irrationality with which we, the 'civilised' ones, treat the world".

 

Am I missing something?  These people are living in the Stone Ages and these pointy-heads think that lifestyle should be "preserved"?  Who the hell do they think they are to make that decision?  Do they think, given a choice, these people wouldn't leap at a chance for electricty, running water, canned food and, oh I don't know, A LITTLE HYGENE? 

 




156 Comments


Golo

Welcome to GOLO, where WRAL.com visitors can comment on stories and create profile pages, blogs and photo galleries.

You must be a registered WRAL.com user to use these tools. Click here to register or log in.

View Comments View Comments


page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4
<prev    next>
sort order: oldest first | newest first

"A true conservation, as the word implies, would leave them to themselves"

lol. No, a true conservative recognizes that people are capable of running their own lives - rather than allowing the goverment to do it for them.

As I've said before, I don't want to force anything on these people, but I believe they have a right to know that they are not alone and that there are other alternatives out there. You all assume YOU know best and want to leave them alone. That's the liberal mantra - we know best. I'm a conservative, I believe folks have fundemental rights and, as the Constitution says, one of those is the pursuit of happiness.

If these folks don't want us around, they can chuck one of those spears through the heart of the first missionary to show up.

But THEY have the right to decide, no YOU.

If it ain't broke don't fix it!!!!!!! Leave those people alone, they've survived for who knows how long and they're just fine.

Trying to change these people would be like trying to change the way birds nest, pfffft!!

OS you are assuming that the pursuit of happiness begins with interference. That does not add up for me.

I'll have to check back later. My boys want to go outside and ride their bikes and they need supervision.

I think our showing up there because we assume we know better than they do could only be considered "liberal."

Several years ago there was a really great movie, "Medicine Man", starring Sean Connery that dealt with a problem similar to this. While in search for "cancer cure" in the wilds of a South American rainforest. One aspect that was dealt with was the unforseen consequences of such an isolated tribe when it is exposed not only to "civilization" but also when the tribe that has lived in blissful ignorance and isolation for millenia, is exposed to things like measles or the common cold, for which they have no natural immunity. Whole tribes can die off in days. This is what happened to perhaps 90% of the native tribes of the North American eastern seaboard when contact was first made from exploring Europeans and indigeous peoples..right here in North Carolina...there are accounts of entire tribes simply laying down and dying by their campfires from these newly introduced diseases. To our eyes these people live in squalor. Perhaps if we were able to see ourselves through their eyes.

reb - That was fiction. There was also a disney movie based on the true story of a missionary who was killed by a lost tribe and how the family went on to befriend the father's killer. That's the fact. They didn't all die.

And, frankly, your argument supports mine when you consider the fact that, now that this tribe is "found", they WILL be contacted. It can either be through an agency that will support them through the transition, or it can be through soneone who doesn't give a dam.

The genie is out of the bottle.

Oh, and one last thought before I leave: all of you who think this tribe all ready knows there is more out there - if that is true, then there is no harm in contacting them, is there?

"Trying to change these people would be like trying to change the way birds nest,"

WHo said anything about "trying" to change them? I've only said it's up to them to decide.

Leave 'em alone!

"all of you who think this tribe all ready knows there is more out there - if that is true, then there is no harm in contacting them, is there?"

I disagree. In fact, I think this assumption weakens YOUR argument considerably. If they know we're here and they haven't ASKED for our help, then giving it to them anyway is the very definition of imposition.

"End of the Spear"....another movie well worth watching OS. Yes..the genie is out of the bottle. But these people may be happy n their illusions. I seriously doubt that people living here on the edges of afluence are happier. One can't miss what one isn't aware of.

Sue - But you are making assumptions that are unsupportable. I am not. I assume that they have not been introduced to civilization and my assumption is based on their behavior, their remote location and their way of life.

What do you base your assumption on?

OS, that assumption wasn't mine.

Let's suppose alien beings came to earth to "help" us. Do you really think we, here on earth, would just "assume" they're right about everything or should we say thanks but no thanks?? Should we jump on a space ship & fly away w/ them just because they say so....hahaha!!

Hal, that is a very good way to look at it. How insulting would it be to us that these aliens assumed their ways were better and that they could and should save us from themselves.

*sorry, I meant "ourselves"

Sue and Hal - I don't understand your argument. If aliens appear, they have contacted us. That's what I say should happen.

You support the "aliens" sailing away and never giving us the option. Your anaology is exactly the opposite of what you are arguing.

On the other hand, if the aliens had knowledge that we did not have, I would want to learn about their science, math, medicine and discoveries from their travels. I would seek new knowledge.

"Your anaology is exactly the opposite of what you are arguing."

No, this is precisely analogous to our position. The aliens should steer their spaceship away from Earth just as should stay out of this tribe's business.

Sue - But suppose I WANT the aliens to come. Who are you to decide for me that I shouldn't be allowed to have what they could offer?

I'm back.

The aliens come to us teach us their new ways and leave us. They also leave us with diseases that we have no way of protecting ourselves from so that 1/2 of the worlds population dies out from the disease. This is analgous of what you are saying OS. I would say no thanks. I don't want your knowledge if it brings about death and destruction.

"They also leave us with diseases that we have no way of protecting ourselves from so that 1/2 of the worlds population dies out from the disease."

lol. DOn't believe everything you read. No, the aliens leave us with cures for those diseases. If the DON'T come, other aliens will come who will give us those diseases but no cure.

Which will it be?

If the aliens don't come because they are smart enough not to disturb our natural growth then we won't have to worry about any diseases that they bring. I don't want any aliens coming in here unless they bring me a large personal life time gas tank so that I can stop paying the growing price of gas.

Will the aliens finance the restructuring of everything we have ever known?

"If the aliens don't come because they are smart enough not to disturb our natural growth then we won't have to worry about any diseases that they bring."

Again - Why do YOU get to make that decision for ME?

I saw a piece on National Geografic once, someone discovered these people in some jungle, maybe in Brazil, and they had no concept of counting past 3. They brought in pots, pans etc, taught them how to cook, wash themselves, in general....how to improve themselves. The crew went back a year later...the people had discarded the pots & pans, were not washing themselves etc. There was also a new desease they didn't have from there the 1st visit. In other words they weren't any better off....in fact they were worse off.

Some things are just better off left alone.

Hal - You're making my point.

a) They didn't all die like "War of the Worlds" and b) THEY chose the life the lead.

This blog is kind of drifting. There ain't ni aliens.That's all a hypothetical. However the tribe in South America is very real and worthy of debate.

Its good we have a civil difference of opinion, obviously we aren't going to change each other's minds so I'm gonna wish you all a good evening.....its been fun...catch ya later.

reb - Don't blame me: I'm on defense with this one.

The whole world is against me.

Anybody ever watch Star Trek? Anyone ever heard of the 'Prime Directive?"

OS you can make the decision. You can go to them. Why should what you want affect the whole world? If they don't like what they have they can leave. Just walk out of their world and into ours. They do have a choice in how they live. I don't know how you are going to get to where the aliens live but if you lived with these humans you could walk right out of there.

:-)

Reb he has been throwing all kinds of curves in here to try and defend his point. Even the man in Germany who caged his children. I am still waiting for him to come up with a logical argument as to why it would be better for us to invade these people.

grumpy - Again, you ASSUME they know we are here. If they do, then there is no harm in contacting them, it there?

OldReb, the space alien analogy isn't drifting. It is a way of putting ourselves in this tribe's shoes. Not that I'm saying they should wear shoes. LOL

Now, grumpy, that's not fair. You haven't told me why these folks don't have the right to know we exist. Your position is morally indefensable and you know it. There is no analogy that supports your position. None. Not one.

Don't blame me for it.

I don't assume that they know we are here. I assume if they were not happy with what they have they would leave it. They would wander around until they found what they like. In their wondering they would eventually find happiness or just go back to what they had.

I agree with Hal: we could discuss this all night long and not change anyone's mind. It has been an interesting way to pass a hot afternoon, though, and I wish other blogs would stay this civil. Time for me to head out. You all have an excellent evening.

I did not say that they don't have a right to know we are here. I say that they have a right to not be invaded by someone who thinks that they know what is best for them. If they wanted to know if there was more to their world they would investigate it. I am sure their has to be a Marco Polo or Amerigo Vespucchi among them.

See ya Sue. I think OS and I are going to have to agree to disagree as well.

"If they wanted to know if there was more to their world they would investigate it."

Glad I came back because this is truly the bottom line. Okay, good night for real this time.

lol. So they deserve what they've got because they haven't mustered the curiousity and the resources to go looking for something else. Since they haven't hacked their way through thousands of miles of twisted underbrush, they have to stay where they are?

Come on.

Okay, though. I need to get supper rolling. Y'all have a great weekend.

Oh and yukon - where the heck were you, man?

(Dang it. Now I have to do a Chimney Rock blog.)

This was a very good blog OS, thank you for puting it up. Maybe a rerun might be in order. C ya, Hal

I've always thought if the native Americans had the luxury of hindsight, they would have met the Europeans in force at the shoreline, killed everyone that stepped off the ship, and sent the survivors back to where they came from, with tales of a murderous land where it was unsafe to venture. But we can't avoid our fate. Sooner or later it comes to our front door step. This makes me think of Wilmer McLean of Alexandria, Virginia. In the mid 1800's he retired from business life and settled on a small farm near Manassas, Virginia. The first major battle of the Civil War occured there. So he moved...to a lesser known and more rural place in south central Virgina. He carried his family to Appomattox Courthouse , Va. It was in his home the peace terms for Lee's army were dictated. It can be said, "The Civil War began in his backyard, and ended in his parlor." This is moving about as far from the original blog's intent, as hypothetical encounters with ET. But, that's the joy of blogging. ;

I did some reading on the native people of Peru/Brazil after seeing the pictures. I'm not clear on if this tribe is one of the listed tribes. . . however from what I read, most of the tribes have had some-sort of contact and have made it clear that they want to remain as they are. Also, I found it interesting that after integration into society the tribes have in quite a few cases died out for various reasons.

page 1 | 2 | 3 | 4
<prev    next>
sort order: oldest first | newest first

Please log in to add comment.

most recent
   blogs    galleries    profiles    groups    popular  

diet is 'die' with a 't'

    Too lazy to cook for tomorrow?   How about some 'Tasteless...

thanksgiving in afghanistan.....

Thank you seems so inadequate, but, what else can you say on this the eve of our national...

happy thanksgiving

Happy thanksgiving to all in golo land and elsewhere. Special thanksgiving shoutout to all members...

consider the turkey vulture vs tofu turkey

Appearance: The Turkey Vulture's head, like its namesake, is bald...

Generic Profile Image

when i count my blessings.....

It is getting close to the end of my work day and I just had to tell all of you how much you have...

thanksgiving jerky

My son was able to get an e-mail off from Baghram. He said to thank GOLO again for the 100 bags of...

oprah wants you to celebrate the messiah's birth

ABC announces Oprah-Obama Christmas special ...

please help the poor kitty!

My mom brought the cute little cat home yesterday night becasue the lady she cares for wanted to "give"...

lady blue explains how she blew up the duck

The year was 1969 and Ladyblue was doing her first holiday cooking.  Now I came up with a mom...

Perdue announces plans to finish Charlotte traffic loop

gov. perdue announces contract for e-mail archiving

Just received this press release in my inbox.    Raleigh – Gov....

   blogs    galleries    profiles    groups    popular  

Generic Profile Image

profile of barbedwards1982

I'm the mother of two wonderful children, a son age 10 and a daughter age 7. I have been married to...

profile of the m group interiors

Interior Designers serving clients in Raleigh, Durham, Chapel Hill, Cary, Wake Forest and surrounding counties.

profile of tafiliclan1

Where you're going dictates your past.

profile of cokacolasis

fry the child killers and rapist, do not let them lay up in prison for years and years, while we the taxpayers pay for the room and board. take my money and crank up sparky!

Generic Profile Image

profile of rangerdavid

Gun totin left wing liberal vegitarian

profile of faye prosser - smart shopper

My goal is to help everyone live more comfortably within their means. I love to spread the...

Generic Profile Image

profile of js_2

Too busy.

Generic Profile Image

profile of divamomof4

Happiness comes from within...

   blogs    galleries    profiles    groups    popular  

privately public (7 members)

A Public Group for Blogging for "Friends Only" profiles.   This group...

golo happy birthday club (26 members)

  1/8 - justafella  2/2 - sandlapper 2/9 - Sue Donym  2/10-Pom...

therustybucketkidsclub (3 members)

Fans of The Rusty Bucket Kids Club, as well as cast and crew share the fun and the joy the movie and music are bringing to the community.

the book club (17 members)

This group is for those that would like to get involved with monthly readings, or readings at your...

Generic Profile Image

veterans affairs-are you a vfw (2 members)

OK, lets hear from all our proud Veterans here in Golo land! What branch of service were/are...

unemployed goloers corporation (10 members)

The unemployed Goloers Corporation is a newly formed corporation that contains the skills of all people...

motivation for weight loss (4 members)

If you want to lose weight or have already lost the weight.. we need each other to inspire each other to reach the determined goal..

golo weight loss buddy group (9 members)

  This group is for anyone (male or female) interested in "buddying up" with...

crew the raccoon (1 member)

Fans, volunteers and freinds of the Peak City Film Festival in historic downtown Apex, NC, November 20, 21, 22  2009.  

Generic Profile Image

the throne of wisdom (12 members)

   blogs    galleries    profiles    groups    popular  

profile of grumpy-not

Try to find the good in everyone and everything. There is nothing better in life than having...

consider the turkey vulture vs tofu turkey

Appearance: The Turkey Vulture's head, like its namesake, is bald...

Perdue announces plans to finish Charlotte traffic loop

gov. perdue announces contract for e-mail archiving

Just received this press release in my inbox.    Raleigh – Gov....

lady blue explains how she blew up the duck

The year was 1969 and Ladyblue was doing her first holiday cooking.  Now I came up with a mom...

please help the poor kitty!

My mom brought the cute little cat home yesterday night becasue the lady she cares for wanted to "give"...

thanksgiving jerky

My son was able to get an e-mail off from Baghram. He said to thank GOLO again for the 100 bags of...

this is why you should lock your car doors...

 I just read this here.  I...

oprah wants you to celebrate the messiah's birth

ABC announces Oprah-Obama Christmas special ...

Generic Profile Image

retailers

I know that earlier this week, that someone, who works in Retail, asked everyone to be nice to the...