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unambiguous, measurable miracle (prayer answer)

Published January 16, 2008
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Unambiguous, Measurable Miracle (prayer answer)   

 

Want to prove your particular god (Jehovah, Jesus, Thor, Vishnu, Amon-Ra, Poseidon, Pele, etc.) exists?  There is no better way than demonstrating it with a unambiguous, measurable miracle.  This has been the accepted standard for centuries, yet for some reason our current day “believers” do not grasp what it means.  Even the bible is chock full of these type of miracles.  We’ll concentrate on Christianity given that’s the dominate mythology in this country and where my expertise lies.   

 

First of all, let’s examine what a miracle is.  In the religion field, it’s an extraordinary event caused by god.  It’s something that you can’t generally explain with secular science.  If I was able to levitate an eight ton boulder just by saying, “in the name of god, boulder, arise!”, most would consider this a miracle, with the power coming from some supernatural force.  Please keep in mind, not knowing how something is done does not mean it is miraculous.   

 

So, what if you have a wart on your finger, and you pray to Vishnu to remove it, and a couple of weeks later it is gone?  Is this a miracle?  Well, it could be.  Vishnu could have caused it.  However, we also know that the body can heal itself.  That’s where the unambiguous and measurable parts come in.  While an illness being healed, or someone donating money to you in a time of need, etc. might be true miracles, the fact that they also can occur outside the influence of supernatural forces means that you can’t logically use them as proof that gods and miracles occur.  So, what if while fishing, you pray to Poseidon to catch a fish and suddenly you do?  Miracle?  Again, possibly yes, but you also have to consider the possibility that it was coincidental.   

 

There are many, many examples of unambiguous miracles in the bible.  But for the sake of brevity, I’ll only use one as an example. It’s one of my favorite because the implications are complex.  In 2 kings 20, God tells King Hezekiah that he’s going to die from his illness.  Hezekiah cries and prays so hard that God changes His mind, and says He’ll heal him.  Now get this, God’s word wasn’t good enough.  Hezekiah wanted a miraculous sign.  And God did it!  God moved the shadow of the temple BACKWARDS! (presumably by moving the sun backward, but no matter how He did it, it was a miracle).  While it’s not pertinent to this article, I think it’s amazing that you can talk God into changing His mind.  The main thing it shows is that you can ask for a miracle as PROOF and get it.  Combine this with Jesus saying you can move a mountain with faith as small as a mustard seed and we’re ready to rock and roll.

   

So to all you believers out there, SHOW ME A MIRACLE! Give me a sign. Show me proof, just like they did in the bible.  Don’t say “bring it on” if you’ve got nothing for me.  I’ll take ANYTHING as long as it’s measurable, and most importantly, UNAMBIGUOUS.  Move a mountain, or move a pebble.  Heal the lame, or heal a paper cut (spontaneously of course).  How about making one of our war heroes that have lost a limb, whole again?  Anything will do.

   

Conclusion?  No one will step up to this task.  Oh, there will be plenty of excuses (I’m pretty sure I’ve heard them all), but absolutely no one will be able to offer a single, tiny little miracle.  The bible has miracle after miracle being done, some solely as proof of God and His word, yet we all know that NOT A SINGLE PERSON will be able to accept my challenge.  Why?  Well, we all know the answer to that question, even if most of you don’t want to admit it.

   

But in case I’m wrong, and someone does have the faith of a tiny mustard seed, tell me what miracle you’re going to ask your god to perform and I’ll be looking for it.  If you want something simple, I have one of those crystals with the laser etching inside of it, on my desk.  Get your god to turn it upside down.  Yeah I know, that’s not nearly as dramatic as the sun moving backward, and no one will see it but me, but it WOULD CERTAINLY convince me and you’d hear me screaming about it at the top of my lungs.

   

I’m waiting…

 



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Peacebee,

Please trust me, I don’t lump all Christians together. My logic and methodology is much, much too strong to fall into that kind of reasoning. While an outside observer might think that’s what I mean, the context of my use of “Christians” refers to the ones I’ve dealt with, here and in other venues.

Yeah, I’m hoping someone with the faith of a mustard seed will step forward and show me the light, just like they did all the time in the bible. But I’m not counting on it.

Ah lightfoot...do not lump all Christians in the same bucket...that is a gross and very non-intellectual move...totally illogical to say they are all the same. I hope you do get your miracle, and I hope that it is not hard. Until then...Shalom!

Smorgas_Of_Borg,

Notice how the “Christians” are starting to get nasty out here now? That’s their nature I guess.

Yes, I actually read your blog, but it seemed more like a testimonial so I didn’t think it would be appropriate for me to post on it. Personally I think it was the body healing itself rather than a supernatural event, especially since it wasn’t a complete “healing”.

Some miracles are just physical proof, like the shadow moving for the king. What’s so wrong with asking for that, just like he did? He gets away with it yet the "Christians" are spitting on me! :)

Tidbit,

So if a church prays for help with their finances (i.e. money), they are being “worthless, childish, petty” and “greedy”, eh? Be nasty all you want, it just shows your true NON Christian nature. But it’s what I’ve come to expect from those that thump the bible, but never read or follow it. Truly pathetic.

Tidbit,

“Egocentricism”? Is that something you got from Jimmy Swaggart. I have plenty of compassion and tolerance, and understand people and their faith all too well. Go read my blog again and see if you see any attacks. I have my beliefs, but there were no attacks. All the nastiness and attacks came from YOUR side of the aisle. What was that about tolerance?

“Even if a miracle….” Yeah, like I’ve said, I’ve heard all the excuses. That seems to be a favorite because it gets used a lot. The old, I can show you a miracle but I won’t because you won’t believe it routine. It gets old. All I’m asking for is what is shown in the bible and promised by the bible.

Hey, lightfooot, et al. I posted a little blog about my take on 'miracles'. You'll see we share a lot of common ground. But, I did take the opportunity to offer my little bit of an opinion on what a miracle is. Good blog, great discussion, too!

Miracles Blog: http://www.wral.com/golo/blogpost/2314644/

“Unbelievers always ask for miracles as if the absense of such justifies their position” – OldRebel

So now you’re claiming King Hezekiah was an “unbeliever”???!!! Do you people even read the bible?! If you want to debate the nature of God with me, I suggest you actually read the bible first, then get back to me.

Logically, if the “Children of Israel” had REALLY seen all that stuff, there would be NO disbelief. That’s your first clue that the details associated with the exodus are fabrication.

Lightfoot3 - your egocentricism and lasck of compasion or tolerance or understanding of people and their faith, there is no way that even if a miracle was to bite you in the face you'd see it. The things you ask for are worthless, childish, petty and frankly, (like wad of money comment in previous post) gredy. I use to be like you.. Thankfully, I'm not anymore.

Unbelievers always ask for miracles as if the absense of such justifies their position. Believers have no need to ask for a miracle. I truly believe if you saw a miracle, that wouldn't cause you to believe. The Children of Israel saw many miracles, yet none entered the Lnad of Promise due to their disbelief. But you can hang onto that justification. God doesn't need to prove Himself to me. What He does is His perogative. He's not in a box ready to jump out and perform for our benefit. Yes that plays into why you may see no miracles. So be it. There's your justification.

I understand and appreciate people telling me why they believe. But I’m asking for a fresh miracle today, just like was done in the bible, for the same reasons in the bible, to make me believe. My crystal being turned upside down or that water being turned into wine would be great. Both are still on my desk, and so far, unchanged.

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